Hello Anime Vice users, welcome to the sites' first ever "Roundtable User Discussion".
me explain a bit of what this is. This idea began at our sister site,
Comic Vine, where a handful of users virtually
got together to discuss a topic related to comic books. After a
successful first Roundtable (which you can read HERE
) I thought it would be nice to do a similar
discussion here on Anime Vice. So, a bunch of AV users virtually met up
to talk anime, manga and more.
After you read our conversation be sure to comment below where you can submit your own
opinions after reading ours.
So let's begin! Hi I am Geo ( sora_thekey) moderator of this discussion. I
have five Anime Vice users with me who you guys may know: sickVisionz,
FoxxFireArt, Newten, sotyfan16 and ShadowKnight508. Welcome to the first
ever Anime Vice "Roundtable" guys.
Greetings, Watashi wa namae Kristoffer Remmell desu. I was born and
raised in Northern Kentucky. I'm a free lance graphic artist who creates
a 4koma project based on the second season of Code Geass
was quite popular on the internet. I gave permission for it be
translated into five different languages. I've been into manga and anime
since maybe middle school but more so
after high school. I'm pretty much into everything except yuri and yaoi
stories.I enjoy action, adventure, ecchi, and a little hentai. This
gives me a pretty good knowledge on most facets of anime and manga. I am
also morally and passionately against censorship. I'm catching up on a
variety of shows, but one I watch very regularly is One Piece
Hello, I am Will Anderson from the valleys of Northern California, and I
have been an anime/manga fan since the days of when the Pokemon
shows began in the late 1990's. I am a big fan of all things
harem/ecchi, action/adventure, and comedy anime-wise, so if you have
recommendations on a good series, drop me a line! Right now, I am
playing catch up on One Piece and reading the Sora no Otoshimono
Hi everyone! I'm sotyfan16. I'm a regular user of Anime Vice but some of you may recognize me from the Dunce Cap
video blogs and a number of Beginner's Guides
I have only been regularly into anime since 2008 and have since
accumulated a nice collection of anime and manga. I also work on anime
ideas of my own from time to time while learning some Japanese here and
there. I find it funny that my name is Will, too! Haha so we'll call you guys ShadowWill and Willfan16. sickVisionz:
Hey, this is William Taylor aka sickVisionz on the site. I'm a Georgia
native and have have been watching anime casually since I was a little
kid back in the 80s and early 90s with stuff like Voltron
, Saber Rider
and Samurai Pizza Cats
. I got into anime seriously around 2001 when my
roommate during my freshman year invited me out to watch Vampire Hunter D
at out school's movie theater. My tastes in anime are all over the
place with a list of favorites that include show like Paniponi Dash
, School Days
and Time of Eve
but I always have a soft spot for series that are a bit of a downer. Willfan16:
Is 3 Williams getting out of hand? Maybe it's just fishy...It is
and awesome name though. sickVisionz:
Yeah, Will's are awesome. No shock there. If it counts, my second name is Christopher so we've got two of those as well.
I'm Dan and I'm here to party.
Cool now that we know a little bit about each other. Let's get started.
After the Quake
of all I want to bring up a sad conversation. We all know
that the point of origin to all out anime and manga vices was recently
struck hard by the earthquakes and tsunami. Anything you guys would like
to mention about this?
My heart goes out to all those affected by this disaster in Japan. As a
responsible individual and a charitable one, I went forth and donated
the $100 that I had intended to buy more Fate/stay Night
and Rosario + Vampire Season II
manga to the Disaster Relief Fund of the Red Cross. I hope that no one
involved in the manga/anime industry was injured or adversely affected
by this tragic earthquake/tsunami disaster. Newten:
I think with all the coverage it's had there isn't much I can say that
hasn't already been said, I'd just urge anyone with any spare cash to
donate to Red Cross to help Japan out right now. I will say this though,
all the people out there saying this is some sort of retribution for
Pearl Harbour and whatever else needs a good kick to the face.
I can't say enough that it is a tragic event. While not on the scale
of the tsunami a few years ago, this one has had a greater impact on the
world in regards to business and travel. While I have not donated money
to relief myself, I have re-tweeted some so that more money goes to
Japan to provide aid. Many anime/manga creators have also contributed
money. I read that One Piece creator, Eiichiro Oda
, gave 15 Million Yen (a little over $183,000) of his own money. FoxxFireArt:
Well, Oda sure can afford it. Seeing how the past few volumes of One Piece
in Japan have been selling over 2 Million units in their first four days of release. Those kind of sales are astounding. sickVisionz:
I send wishes of peace and love out to everyone affected by the horrible tragedy that took place in Japan. FoxxFireArt:
The events in Japan are utterly tragic and it's disturbing how the
people can't catch a break so far. First earthquakes, tsunami, and now
fires at nuclear reactors threatening a contamination leak. Past that.
I'm not sure the topic is incredibly appropriate for a bunch of people
across the Atlantic who can only guess at the trauma inflicted. I just
hope that no more have to lose their lives and families than has already
Alright, Foxx makes a good point. Let's move on.
Sora no Otoshimono
First of all I wanted to know what was the latest manga you read and/or anime you watched.
The last anime I watched was Naruto Shippuden
#202 earlier today and the last manga I read was Naruto #531
Hmm...the latest manga that I have read is Chapter 48, Volume 11 of the
Sora no Otoshimono manga. Tomoki and Astraea get involved in antics that
nearly lead to a castration and being killed by the powerful Yakuza
family of Mikako.
As for the latest anime that I have watched,
One Piece Episode 130. It wraps up the end of the long, interesting
Baroque Works Saga: Arabasta Arc in which Luffy and the gang help save
the Kingdom of Arabasta for their friend Vivi from the Baroque Works
Organization and it's wicked, heartless leader, Mr. 0.
The last one I read was AiON
Vol. 2 (though I just finished 7 other volumes). The most recent anime I watched was Onii-chan No Koto Nanka Zenzen Suki Janain Dakara Ne!!
episode 10. Newten:
The latest anime episode I've watched is Fairy Tail
episode 70, which
I've been following for a while now and I'm thoroughly enjoying it every
week, there's something I find refreshing about it compared to things
like Bleach. Speaking of which, the latest manga chapter I've read is
Bleach chapter 440. Honestly, I don't really know what to think of
Bleach these days, in my opinion it's just not what it used to be. I
hope it picks up and becomes more interesting soon, but I'll trudge on
The last volume I read was Fullmetal Alchemist Vol. 21
and I still need to catch up on my scanlations for One Piece
, and I'm way behind on the scans of Naruto
. Scans are the only way to enjoy those series properly. I did re-watch Soul Easter Ep. 1
the other day. I wanted to format the Anime Vice
wiki pages for the episode. In my case, I just finished reading Amnesia Labyrinth Vol. 1, Ultimo Vol.
2, Alice in the Country of Hearts Vol. 1 and watched Mitsudomoe
Most of you mentioned series that are well over the
100 episode/chapter mark. We always begin on epidose/chapter one. Think
of your favorite manga or anime. What was it that made you want to keep
reading or watching after that first episode or volume?
My favorite manga is Sundome
suhn-doh-may). What made me kept reading it is the story. To be frank,
the protagonist develops a relationship with a girl who says she will
not have sex with him. Period. Then came a flurry of strange fetishes,
comedy, and drama. I was hooked off the bat and now own all 8 volumes.
For anime it has to be Code Geass
I kept watching the series from episode 1 because I just knew the story
was going to be smart and full of action. Great anime overall and my
top favorite. The dub voices also kept bringing me back-and maybe Kallen
Hmm...my favorite anime to this day is Bleach
, even though I am currently slogging through the Bount Arc
on Episode 104). What kept me interested in it was the cast of
characters, the random moments, the humor, and watching Ichigo and the
gang overcome each new threat that threatens either the Soul Society or
As for manga, the Sora no Otoshimono manga is addictive
for several reason. Seeing how far Tomoki will go to achieve his
perverted desires (which all backfire), seeing the gang get involved in
wild misadventures, and the great ecchi-infused humor is what keeps me
reading it each time a new chapter is released on MangaFox. FoxxFireArt:
The Bount Arc is really boring, but it's weird how those Mod Souls
introduced in that story are kept and added to the events of canon
Bount Arc sucks and I wish I would have skipped it. Only been watching the dub so I'm only at ep 180.
I would skip it, but as stated earlier, I am a completion-ist, so I will
continue to slog through it and hope for better episodes after Ichigo
takes down the Bount.
Well, if we're going for favorite series of all time, then I'm one of
the Dragon Ball Z
kids. I was instantly hooked on that show all those
years ago. It's just the ultimate testosterone-fuelled power fantasy,
there are other franchises that come close, like Bleach and Naruto, but
they still aren't quite the same.
Now if we're talking about my favorite series right now, I'd have to say Yumekui Merry
. It's got a
great story, really interesting characters and it stands out as
something fairly original. Lots of anime series play it safe to appeal
to a wide audience, so it's nice to see something different.
Basically whatever the franchise is, if it draws me in and keeps me interested, I'll keep following it.
My favorite long running anime series would be Naruto. I actually
started with the third or fourth episode because that's where Cartoon
Network was at the time. What kept me watching it at that point was
that it was funny and I thought that it'd be pretty cool to see them use
the tactics and tricks they learning during combat. A few episodes
later they did (Team 7 vs Zabuza) and I've been hooked ever since then.
Cool, now I have a couple of series I want to take a look at after what you
guys said! None of us live in Japan but we understand that
the process of anime series is a lot different that that of a television
series (whether it's animated or not).
Usually that first episode (Pilot) is what tells the people working on
the series if they will continue or not. Anime, on the other hand,
usually has an ending panned out from the start.
That 80s Show?
Which process do you guys think works better? (In this case I guess that
series like Bleach, Naruto, One Piece and Fairy Tail would have to be excluded)
Uhh, good question. I guess I'd say anime works better, because anime
based on manga is already tried and tested. They don't just turn any
manga into full-blown anime, it has to be popular enough. I've seen so
many TV shows tank because they don't get the viewing numbers they need,
it's a shame.
I just find it a bit silly when an anime tones down violence or nudity from the manga counterpart. Remember in BLEACH
how Kuukaku Shiba
has an amputated arm for the manga, but the anime version they added a prosthetic arm that doesn't do anything? ShadowWill:
I think the anime process works better overall. It has a story, it has
the ending in place for when it does end, and to me that is better than
doing a Pilot episode like TV shows do. Anyone remember the FOX pilot
for That '80's Show? No? It was on for 1 episode less than a year after
That '70's Show ended, but hardly anyone remembers it.
That 80s Show? I didn't even know there was such a thing.
Rei Tachibana from Paniponi Dash
I think it's totally case by case. Paniponi Dash and Hayate no Gotoku
don't really go anywhere and I think the series is pretty much flying
blind and doesn't really follow any type of overarching plot, but
they're some of my favorites. On the other hand a show like Erin is
completely planned out from the get go and it's really good as well. I
think it's an issue of execution more than one being better than the
other by default.
I still enjoy a few American TV shows but I have to say that anime feels
so much better in regards to storyline. I like how anime is done
because usually there is source material (manga, video game, etc.).
Also, anime runs by the actual seasons of the year so they are somewhat
easy to keep track of and watch (just over 20 min time commitment).
Newten makes a good point though. TV shows depend on ratings so much
that sometimes good shows can't advance. Plus, like Willfan16 said, the
source material is well established unlike other shows where the writing
advances as the show progress. I would also like to add that anime
seems to have a better grasp of story since an ending has been set in place. There is no need for fillers. How is it that it works for shows like Bleach, Naruto and One Piece? They certainly don't seem to be ending soon.
Naruto, One Piece and Bleach
For anime/manga like Bleach, Naruto, and One Piece I look to Bakuman
the anime and manga) to say that they are battle manga and therefore
attract a large and dedicated demographic from the very start with Shonen Jump
Also, Bleach and Naruto get broadcast on TV. These long-running series
provide the more simple things in anime, which makes them more open to
popular appeal. The really good stuff is in the niche series. sickVisionz:
He summed up my opinion on it
lol Yes! The only thing I can add is to say that shonen tittles are able
to keep going because of all the anime-only filler that gets thrown in
to keep the franchise alive.
The filler takes place so that the manga can on occasion catch up to or
surpass the anime, since the anime can catch up to the manga from time
to time (reason for all of those filler episodes on Naruto that lasted
for months). I do not mind filler, so long as it involves the characters
that I care about doing something relevant.
I agree with your thoughts on filler Shadow. I think it gets an incredibly bad
rep from anime fans in general. I don't like bad filler but when a
filler episode is interesting and highlights characters who don't always
get a lot of time in the spotlight, I don't get where the hatred for it
I've only seen Bleach filler and that was the Bount Arc, so my opinion
is not to be taken as well informed. Overall I think that there is good
and bad filler. The good helps shed more light on less important
characters and the bad provides a meandering tangent of usually some
nice action but boring story.
I actually dropped out of watching the anime of BLEACH
just as the Hueco Mundo Arc started, but I've been meaning to catch up. I dropped out of the Naruto anime about the time of Sai
joining the team.
There are always exceptions to the rule. Bleach, Naruto and One Piece
are just massively popular manga series that keep on going with no end
in sight. Still, apart from filler the anime is still based on the
manga, so as long as the manga is popular, the anime will likely be
I'm not so sure about Naruto
though, that seems to ending with the way
the manga is going. We now know Naruto's origin, who the main villain
is, there is this giant war where all the characters are facing the
figurative and quite literal "ghosts of their past", and I don't see how
tops this unless he's sending Naruto into space. All that's really left
after this is to finish up the events with Sasuke. I just don't see
where Kishimoto can take Naruto
with the way things are going unless they have some drastic reboot, ala Dragonball Z
. One Piece
on the other hand, is only at the very literal half way point. Funny
when Oda thought the series was only going to last a maximum of seven
So how I understand it Foxx, you are saying that it all depends on how
much story you can squeeze out of the characters and settings. Bakuman
actually thought me about the differences on why some of the manga are
more popular than others, but I want your opinions.
Well, the idea of what makes one manga/anime more popular than any other
is kind of a mystery. Something that writers struggle with constantly.
It's hard to tell what's going to be popular. Most manga series will
often start out as one-shots in magazines such as Shonen Jump
in Japan or it's publication serialized manga magazine equivalents. I'm not sure if there was ever a simple one-shot of BLEACH
, but I know that there were one-shots that were rather different than the final product of One Piece
. Soul Eater
as a three-part one-shot that was picked up for serialized for monthly
release. Though, now that I think of it, the first chapter of BLEACH
like a one-shot since some of the early events contradict events from
the rest of the following chapters. It's with the ghost of the dead girl
. She didn't have a soul chain on her chest and that was suppose to be a part of what separates ghosts from Hollows
. The chain was added for the anime version of the scene. So those Shonen Jump magazine one-shots could easily be the "Pilots" of the manga industry.
FoxxFireArt: Shonen Jump
isn't the only manga anthology magazine. There are many others. The U.S. version of Shonen Jump
is utterly pointless though. A
lot of people tend to say, "it gets better in the third episode." or
"the first volume is not good, it is better in the sixth volume". Let
me ask the prominent question: How important are the first
episode/chapter of a series?
If it's really exciting and interesting, it needs to maintain that to
some degree in it's following chapters, otherwise people will drop it. I
think it's actually better if it doesn't blow everyone's sock off, but
shows promise. Then it can build up after the first chapter and become
more and more popular as it progresses. Either way, that first chapter
is definitely important. If it fails to grab any attention, it's done.
The first chapter/episode of a series is very important to the overall
success of the anime/manga in question. Most readers/viewers judge what
they see in the first episode/chapter and use that as a decision point
as to "should I continue or pass on this". First impressions are
everything, and failing to anything major in the 1st episode that
warrants the attention or caring of potential fans can be the deathblow
to the series. I wish that Read or Die
(R.O.D) was more than three episodes, for I loved the three episodes that I saw on Adult Swim in 2006/2007. FoxxFireArt:
Most series tend to get better when they get the chance to evolve and
grow. When series begin, they spend so much time on exposition rather than story telling. They are trying to explain this new world to the
I think the first episode of an anime is
quite important as it needs to give the general idea of what the story
is and who the characters are. Now, I'm guilty of watching a number of
shows that don't quite do that but they caught me as interesting so I
kept watching further eps. For me the first volume of a manga tells me
what I need to know for whether or not I'll keep purchasing the series.
The nice thing is my math tells me there are generally 3 anime
episodes/volume of manga. I think manga is a lot better (obviously since
it's the source material) at letting the reader know who the characters
are, where the story is starting out, and an idea of what's to come. So
overall, while the first ep/volume is important, it isn't always a turn
off if I'm not super wowed until the next one.
Neon Genesis Evangelion
I've always thought that the opening episode is critical. It's the whole you only get one first impression
thing. I don't see this too often anymore, but when I first got into
anime it seemed like most anime didn't really try to make a good first
impression. In fact, the earlier episodes were often some of the worst
in the entire series. A good first episode to me introduces the basic
tone and concepts of series. A good example for me would be Evangelion
a nice introduction to the basics of the series and sets up what's
going to come afterward. I think that's the ideal method to approaching
a first episode.
I like the way sick and ShadowWill worded that. The first
episode/chapter is definitely the "First Impression" for the
reader/audience. Then again, Newten makes another good point. I am a
huge fan of the Digimon franchise, and we never saw the evil digimon
scheming against the kids until halfway in the series. I wouldn't want
for the first episode of the series to be better than the last. Like
Foxx said, there needs to be progression.
All very good points.
If you were to recommend the first chapter of a manga or the first
episode an anime, just as a stand-alone "one-shot" what would you
I don't get the meaning of your question. Are you asking for specific examples from series, or just in general manga/anime? Well, what I meant was: if you were to recommend a first episode or a
first chapter as a compelling enough story to stand alone which would
Wow, this is a bit of a hard one. It took me a while but I'd say Katanagatari
. It's a 12 episode series about two people on a quest to collect twelve
swords and, surprise surprise, one sword is collected per episode. I
think that would work as a one shot because it completely wraps up the
story that it's trying to tell in a neat and tidy way. I think a lot of
episodic shows would work well for this one-shot method as well because
each episode is telling it's own story and reaches a conclusion that
feels satisfying. A one-shot that introduces a bunch of questions and
doesn't really resolve anything would make me want to punch a brick.
I say the first three episodes of Soul Eater
are good to watch. Since most manga in the U.S. are in volume forms. It's hard to recommend a single chapter. The problem is that most of the first chapters of mangas are pretty much
stand alone. You'll notice that in a volume format, the first chapter
is almost always longer than average. Naruto, BLEACH, One Piece, Highschool of the Dead
, and Negima!
. The list goes on with manga. Also, very few first episodes of anime are "to be continued" (though every episode of One Piece ends with that title card)
Ugh..that's a tough one. For manga I say check out Vol. 1 of Ultimo
. It's different and interesting. Plus, you can't go wrong with Stan Lee
! For anime I'm going to say episode 1 of Rainbow
. Rainbow is good on so many levels to me so I'll simply say the series is dramatic in a wonderful and engrossing way.
Hmm...as a Ecchi/Harem fan, I can recommend taking a look at the Heaven's Lost Property
(also known as Sora no Otoshimono) anime. Witness Tomoki Sakurai
as his quiet, peaceful (although perverted) way of life is shattered by
the arrival of a mysterious angel that falls from the skies.
As for manga, Chapter #1 of the Freezing
manga was pretty good and got me interested in it. Those are the two that I can recommend at this time.
Zero no Tsukaima
The first episode of Zero no Tsukaima
. If offers a good introduction to the main characters and you can relate to the protagonist, Saito
, because he comes from the real world (kind of like Alice in Wonderland). It really drew me in.
Wow I really want to watch Zero no Tsukaima now that you compared it to Alice in Wonderland!
In my case I would recommend X-Men: Misfits Vol. 1, if you read comic
books then you might not like it because it's so different from the
original comic counterpart but then again you might enjoy the change of pace. As for anime, if
you like moe and pointless conversation then watch Lucky Star. Most of
the episodes stand alone as it is anyways!
Well, that's all there
is to say about this topic (Well, there's probably more but we've gone on for quite enough). Share with us what you think about the
first chapters and first episodes in the comments below.
Would you guys like to say good bye.
I have nothing more to say...I am late in doing some chores around the
house....I will take my leave. Good luck on the post, sora_thekey xD
Farewell, my fellow AV Roundtable Discussion members....it has been a pleasure.
It's been fun doing this and I hope to see you all again. Feel free to
ask me about any of the anime or manga I mentioned and look forward to
more discussions like this and more material from me! Now...Silence! I keel you!
As a closer I'd like to say thanks to Sora for coming up with the idea and it's been a pleasure to participate.
I've enjoyed the discussion. I do think it could of branched out to talk
about series specifically, but we'll save that for another time.
Thanks for having me! Even if nobody finds this interesting it's been fun for me, I hope we get to do more.
Next week's topic is "gratuitous use of breast-bouncing in anime" right? Alright I'm in. Nice try Dan!
Anyways, I am Geo/sora_thekey signing off. Bye! さようなら
-- Geo ( sora_thekey
) 24/7 geek! -- Follow me on Twitter: @sora_thekey