Shikamaru for me
Tenth Doctor(Doctor Who)
Slim Shady (Eminem alter-ego)
Captain Jack Harkness (Torchwood)
Peter Griffin ( Family Guy)
Korra,Zuko and Amon (Avatar)
Batman ( DC comics)
@Whats_out_the_bag: I have a hard time seeing how a human could deal with a 1000 clones with superhuman strenght or summoning something like Gamabunta.Especially since your OP implies Naruto knows where his opponent is granting him the surprise advantage.
@Newdeath: Precisely. We don't know what happened during that fight; Hashirama may have been able to nullify the power of the Kyuubi (by making it obey him, or freeing it from Madara perhaps using his own influence over bijuus) or he could have had the power of all 8 tailed beasts at his disposal for all we know. Given his performance against the 3rd, I find it very, very unlikely that he could have beaten Madara and the Kyuubi at once with his strength alone. For all the Hashirama fanboys protesting, edo tensei does not make them 10 times weaker; he lacked his mind, yes, but if he was capable of beating an EMS Madara and the Kyuubi then he would have crushed Sarutobi regardless.
QFT. Hashirama is , based on his showing way weaker then Itachi,the biggest feat you could say he has is producing the Flower World jutsu and that is solely based on what Madara has shown .
What it says in the title
I know what the fucking 6 paths are, The Rinne part of the dojutsu is the cycle of reincarnation or rebirth in several Indian religions. This is reflected in the names of all Six Paths of Pain, which share the names with Samsaric realms of reincarnation.
Each of pains bodys used ONE path, Madara said when we first seen him with his 6 bodys, He would have prefered stronger hosts for his 6 PATHS (something along those lines refering to his 6 hosts).
Well that is my point if you define paths as those powers and not as the bodies themselves and you only see the bodies as HOSTS .Well then there is no reason why the jinchuurikis themselves aren't permitted in to the match .Knowing they aren't using said paths.
You're only reason at this point to oppose that is "Well it would be stupid". When as I said you're idea of how the match should be also depowers the rinnegan.
These are the 6 PATHS the OP is refering to since the rinnegan ONLY gives you access to their jutsu why would he give him the Rinnegan, AND THEN TAKE AWAY THEIR FUCKING POWERS FROM HIM??????
And once again why he is on his own. NO OTHER HELP, SO NO BIJU DAMA!
You're doing the same in the way that you're limiting the power of rinnegan as well the only difference is that I am saying he can't use paths and you're saying he can't use the bodies both are aspects of the power of the dojutsu. As you conceded the jinchurikis would only be HOSTS meaning that they are allowed since THEY AREN'T USING THE POWER OF THE PATHS
He held the sun in the palm of his had for god sake, Tob is a long shot off EVER doing something as powerful as that,
This is besides the point.Even if he held the sun in his hand he was only able to create this phenomenon on a small scale to say he'd city level by example because of that is a no-limit fallacy.
No since he can bypass the law of equivalevent exchange he should be able to do it easily.
The law of equivalent exchange is that you have lose something to gain something of equal value please tell me how bypassing that tells him what material is Tobi's@Yusuke52 said:
The only reason Father didn't go on an all out rampage, was the same reason why Flash will never blitz all his enemy the second he sees them, The plot demanded him otherwise. Frankly if they didn't have Hoinheim and there was no plot to say otherwise Father would have killed them all right there and then, with no remorse and in the span of a few minutes, because that is how powerful he is, and while he might no be as fast as Tobi is, WHY THE HELL WOULD HE NEED TO BE WHEN HE IS AS STRONG AS HE IS?
I don't see how this is relevant when replying to my post about how transmutation is unpractical.For one ,you don't address the fact that transmutation even in God form were performed at close range and they were dodged by a somewhat above average human.
Given that the Third form of Father was healing every attack inflicted upon him, how is Shinra Tensei going to kill him? He can only use it every 5 seconds, at which point father could heal himself and then Tobi will be forced to do so again, and again and again until he is out of Energy, Chakra and Father still has a comfortable 9,000,000 souls left, having not attacked or tried to defend himself, and only healed through Tobis greatest attack each time it was used.
No limit fallacy ,you have nothing to say that Father could himself from Town or mountain level attack.
Oh I know he will BFR him now since well that is instant anyway and he has no chance to escape that before he is absorbe... Oh wait it takes a few seconds for Tobi to do that, unless the subject is willing. A few seconds of immobility and tangibility, and the fact that he has to be in close proximity to the thing he is absorbing, or even TOUCHING for that matter, for a guy who can transmute any object nearby without moving, into any other object without moving... Yeah I can see him falling prey to that one now. Lets not even bring the Gate into this since I now believe he wount even need it to escape.
Oh my, just oh my. the more we get into this the more I think you never finished FMA, he had 5,000,000 souls left when he used up the souls of amestris. He had 5,000,000 souls left when greed carbonized his skin, He had 5,000,000 souls left when he was punched in the chest by Ed.
THAT is the reason he went unstable because Ed allowed the souls of Xerxes to escape. Jesus at least check the wiki.
Yeah it also takes a few seconds for transmutation , my hypothesis is that the guy that has proven himself to be faster will be able to catch the other guy first.Hence , Tobi wins.
I didn't finish it? The scan above clearly shows him unable to suppress the power and seeking a philosopher stone for that purpose.
Umm I dont know how to tell you this but... No. Kakashi say they cant use them then GAI says "Tobi will not want to waste his Chakra using said jutsu since they knew how to counter them." Kakashi then said that "It must take alot of chakra controling 6 jinchuriki at once with his eyes "(Validating this point) not saying to Gai "no he cant use them" just saying "it must take alot of chakra to control them". To which Tobi responds with you have good eyes Kakashi (Infering to his deduction that it requires alot of chakra to control them, not that they cant use the paths).
Are you just seeing things the way you want to see them, or did you really think thats what happened? If the latter I think Shounen manga might be a little to complicated for you, It was hard to understand all that text after all.
What the hell?As I told you the jinchuurikis don't have the powers of the six paths @Yusuke52 said:
whether it is because Tobi does not make them use it or because it can't happen does not matter the fact remains that by using the jinchurikis Tobi is not using the Paths necessarily hence the usage of bijuus themselves SHOULD. NOT. BE. A . PROBLEM.
I agree let's agree to disagree I have porn to watch.
@MrASSH0LE: Are you deliberately being hard headed, or did I not explain this simply enough? (Sorry if that is a bit rude, I just dont enjoy having to reapeat something more than once)
Tobi w/ Sharingan and Rinnegan no Six Paths
That CLEARLY means that he does not have the 6 bodys he used to host his 6 paths, since the Rinnegan itself allows the use of the 6 paths why then would he give him the rinnegan and then say "Oh but he cant use it". Its not that hard to understand, and once again why he will never use the Biju Dama against Father.
I have shown you 2 sources demonstrating what is the 6 paths yet you keep on ignoring you are the one being hard-headed.You haven't done anything to refute them.Plus given the fact that the rinnegan allows control of the bodies I could just as easily say that this is another case of he has the rinnegan "Oh but he can't use it".
Either refute it or concede the point .
You're saying the guy with the hypersonic reaction time will be impaled that way?
When last I checked the Sharingan can only track movements of what it can see, and Father can transmute without moving at ALL. Besides Tobi will not be looking at the ground if his opponent is right in front of him now is he? Hence why he will be stabbed in the chest by the earth beneath him. If you would rather, he could transmute his mask to impale his face instead?
You're saying a spike moving to impale Tobi wouldn't move?Because that's the only way your plan works and I have already explained to you why Tobi is faster then Father he could keep up with Yondaime the fastest character in the series and could react Gai's kick showing his reaction time.
I am not sure but wouldn't that require him to know what the mask is? And the closest to transmuting an enemy Father did was when Scar tried to deconstruct him and he replied in similar fashion.... oh wait Scar a super human with supersonic reaction AVOIDED it and there was the time where he tried to turn Ed and the other in to stones but that still required them being at close range.
Finally, you have conceded the fact that Tobi is the fastest of the two hence if anybody 's going to get hit with an attack first it's Father , he's the one who realistically couldn't keep up.Yet you keep saying Tobi's gonna get caught in Father's attacks.
The Shinra tensei as we know levels cities and the chibaku tensei levels surpasses mountains in size.
And with prep Father came close to destroying a country... whats your point. I already said that if he trys to use either he will transmuted, given the length of time it takes to use Chibaku Tensei he will be dead before it takes effect. His only viable attack is Shinra Tensei (And he has not even used it yet), given that it is the strongest attack he can use currently. And once again he has to become Tangible to use it, which would once again let Father transmute him. Besides A Shinra Tensei on Town scale would leave him weak and unable to use it which would put him at an even bigger disadvantage
He goes to use Chibaku Tensei, suddenly he has been transmuted into a statue. He trys to Shinra Tensei, suddenly he has been turned into a chair. As for his speed, it wont matter since any direct contact with Father would lead to his deconstruction, and Fathers attacks would not need travel time so they would be almost impossible to avoid unless you knew they were coming.
Now you're the one I am suspecting of will-full ignorance.You know darn well that he came close to destroying this country with years of preparation and that the OP doesn't even give anyone preparation.Father has also only displayed the ability to transmute close objects ,your theory relies on Tobi going for close combat which he won't do with knowledge(as granted by the OP) he would know to stay away from him either by using teleportation then use Shinra Tensei or Chbaku tensei.Even if hypothetically I believed that would happen Tobi is again faster and would be able to warp Father or use the Hungry Ghost or the Human path before he transmuted him.
What do you mean by the shinra tensei in town scale leaving him weak? Tobi only has to fire it once and Father loses due to the fact that he has never been shown to tank a city level attack .
You say we haven't seen him use it yet here you are saying Father's going to turn people into chairs,into a statue ,that he is going to transmute the air around us and transmute Tobi's mask(funny since he didn't even transmute Ed's auto-mail to turn it against him).
And in regards to Tobi being weak when compaired to state alchemists, I never said he was. You are the one who is saying that, not me. Was it implied by me? No, I just said that it took Greed with his power of carbonization to weaken him, to enable Ed to punch a hole through his chest and cause him to lose his souls and become unstable.
Well then your whole point falls apart.If you say Tobi could not be beaten by those alchemists and those alchemists were able to make Father run out of souls to contain God well then Tobi should that is just logical.
You say the only way they had to defeat him was Greed, that is false the reason Father was unstable was because he had used up his power and was no longer able to contain God.If Greed hadn't done what he did in a worst case scenario he(Father) would die later in a best case one he would lose God and revert back to his old self.
As for the gate Father can open the gate without needing to transmute a country he only done that because he needed to absord God (Or the truth if you will), hell Ed only tried to bring his mother back and he opened the gate. Given that Father has 1,000,000 souls im more than certain he can open the Gate if he wished. As for the Truth part of it, The gate shows you the Truth of what you wish to see, and if this is Fathers Third form then he absorbed the Eye of God which is a seemingly omnipotent being that exists on the other side of the gate. Going by that im sure he will find a way out with 1,000,000 souls at his disposal.
Where is it written that it shows you the Truth you want? Edward described it has having a huge amount of knowledge forced into your mind.
Edit: Unless im mistaken your point about the Jinchuriki's were that they couldnt use the Paths. And that scan just said that Tobi didnt want to waste the chakra on the Paths Jutsu, meaning that they could he just didnt want to use them.
You are mistaken .
The scans states that they can't use them ( Kakashi says it and Tobi validates it) .Yes, because of Tobi not letting them but that isn't really an issue .Whether or not they are doing it out of lack of power or out lack of envy they still technically aren't using the paths.
Listen you're trying to argue that Father who has inferior destructive capacity to Tobi who has either Shinra Tensei and Chibaku Tensei or Six jinchurrikis granting destruction between multi-mountain and town level.Inferior speed , with Tobi fighting hyper-sonic characters and Father possessing supersonic reaction time.
You're only argument at this point is transmutation which requires Tobi to stand close to Father which any person with knowledge would not do.Even Scar who is less fast then Tobi was able to avoid transmutation.
No offence my friend, but this is ridiculous at this point our debate is about whether Tobi has jinchuurikis which would allow him to spam bijuu dama or just produce one bijuu dama with multi-mountain level destruction or if he has Shinra tensei which would destroy the city .On top of that if we take you 're belief that he can use the Pain abilities but not the bodies he can (thanks to the energy equivalence rule) block city block level attacks with absorption which is the most Father demonstrated without preparation.
@MrASSH0LE: The 6 Paths are his other 6 bodys, he does not have them. Thats why Nagato was called the 6 Paths of Pain, he had 6 bodys each representing a different path. Hence why there will be no Biju Dama here. Or in laymans terms the only reason he can use the Biju Dama is because he used the bodys of Jinchuriki as his 6 paths, with out them he cant use it at all. He would still have be able to use the standard rinnegan powers, like Shinra Tensei and whatnot.
Again you're mistaken , the 6 paths refer to the deva path, the animal path, the asura path , etc. Never was were they ever meant to refer to bodies that his why we have the Sage of the Six Paths.
The best you could make would be that the jinchuurikis embody the 6 paths the same Nagato's bodies did but then again Kakashi said himself they didn't have this power.
The bodies aren't themselves paths but the hosts to there power.Hence, the jinchuurikis don't count.
I am gonna quote the animevice profile of rinnegan :" Rinnegan is characterized by six "rings" that surround the pupil. These "rings" each represent one of the six paths of Buddhist reincarnation: Deva, Asura, Human, Animal, Hungry Ghost, and Hell: all of which it derives much of it's powers from."
If I may quote the Naruto wiki :"Because of the fact that he was crippled, Nagato channelled the ability of the Six Paths into six different bodies (one ability per body)"
He would still have be able to use the standard rinnegan powers, like Shinra Tensei and whatnot.
O.K but then he would going by this logic he would have the speed advantage, the reaction time advantage and could cast an attacks that beyond anything Father as ever able to tank.Even if he has those attacks he is superior in speed and could cast them before Father did his transmutations.
The Shinra tensei as we know levels cities and the chibaku tensei levels surpasses mountains in size.
On top of that he would possess Hax such as BFR and intangibility.
Tobi will be waiting a very long time for him to run out of power, need I remind you that he was fighting off an army of people when he was losing that number of souls.
Are you trying to argue Tobi is weaker then the state alchemists?
Or this (pulled this off the wiki, since I thought it was worded better there) (And wow why did I not just say this in the first place lol)
Made of "pyrotex/ignition cloth" and embroidered with unique flame alchemy transmutation circles, these gloves create a spark when Roy rubs his fingers together and allow him to manipulate the concentration of oxygen in the air surrounding his target, raising its density to a level at which it becomes a volatile and flammable oxidizer, and creating narrow pathways of oxygen through which he can direct the ensuing flame that blossoms from the spark. The 'snap' sound is caused by the instantaneous speed at which the highly concentrated gases and sparks react together and pop (not his fingers actually 'snapping', to common belief.)
Well played I will conceide that point.
The only way they managed to kill him was Greed altering his skin to a more brittle substance and then Ed punched a hole through his chest allowing the Xerxesian Souls to escape. Unless tobi can replicate that I cant see him doing any damage to Father.
No, before he died they said he could not contain the stone and if Tobi was able to get as close to Father he could BFR him.
Besides by the time his hand hits the ground to summon it, he would be impaled through the chest by the earth, which Father just transmuted.
Also some of the alchemists in FMA are above Tobi in some areas, given that he is not very destructive or durable. But he does beat them in speed and stamina of course.
You're saying the guy with the hypersonic reaction time will be impaled that way?
And which alchemists would even beat Tobi? You're claim about destructive capacity is null, either I am right and he has jinchuurikis with mountain bustin bombs or you're right and he has shinra and chibaku tensei, soul suck, animal path ,etc. with city to mountain busting destruction ,both attacks being beyond what Father can tank .
or more of the souls in his PS to open the gate and either use it for transportation, or to learn the truth behind Tobi's dimension and a way to escape.
Need I remind you that to open said gate , he needed to sacrifice a country and I don't remember anything about it being used as a mean of transportation.
That there is assuming there is a truth to learn.
@MrASSH0LE: If you had read the rules of the match you would know this is Tobi on his own, there are no others fighting with him. The BFR wont work since Father could easily just use the Gate to get back ala PS.
The rules state Tobi doesn't have the 6 paths , here is the definition link . How exactly does this prevent jinchuriki usage?I didn't really get whaty ou said about the gate could you reformulate it?.
Mustang is able to alter the heat of the air in order to make girls pass out so he can run to their aid, more or less his chat up line. I am sure that the founder of modern alchemy is able to do the same.
In the non-canon 2003 anime series iirc.
Eventually, yes he would run out of souls. Against Tobi? Not a chance in hell. At most you could argue for a tie, but his power puts him far above the whole HST, given the fact that Tobi has nothing that can kill him, put him down, immobilize him or harm him in any fashion.
As I said you don't have to kill him all you have to do it make him run out of power or BFR him.And are you actually suggesting Tobi is weaker then state alchemists who were able to make Father run out of power . And Tobi isn't alone he has jinchuurikis and has shown an ability to summon Kyuubi.
And his reaction time is not really a factor given that he has close to 1,000,000 souls in his PS, which would require him to die 1,000,000 times to be killed for good, and coupled with that fact the air is now a deadly substance of your choice, Tobi would only be killing himself anytime he wanted to attack Father.
He doesn't need to kill him as I said BFR is an option.
Father would run out of souls eventually.Did the Sacrifices and the state alchemists need to kill Father this many times ? No, they just tried to make him use his stone until he ran out and got swallowed by Truth.Nothing says he could block or even comeback from a beast bomb with mountain or multi mountain level destruction, to insist he could is a no- limit fallacy.
he can only remain intangible for up to 5 mins, leaves him unable to take any action against Father without getting himself killed one way or another
Jinchuurikis or Kyuubi should be able to attack him regardless of Tobi's state.
Also I am pretty sure God Father only barely surpassed five minutes.
@MrASSH0LE: Avoiding his attacks is easier said than done, given that he is able to transmute all the air in the vicinity into a deadly substance combined with that fact that he can only remain intangible for up to 5 mins himself anytime he wanted to attack Father.
I don't remember Father or any alchemist transmuting air but even if that was happening ,Tobi would still be intangible for 5 minutes hence the gas would not affect him.Or he could teleport depending on the scale.