Halberdierv2 (Level 17)

I hate feeling sick...
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50% wacky martial arts, 50% crazy romcom, all 100% awesome!
50% wacky martial arts, 50% crazy romcom, all 100% awesome!

Hey Vicers,

I've restarted my work on the Ranma 1/2 page that I began last year (2011). There are a lot of episodes to cover (161 in total!), and working on them each in detail might take a lot more time than I can afford. what I've decided to do is give each page a basic layout that tells you a general synopsis of the episode, so each page will have something in it, in case I can't give every episode an in depth anylasis.

I'll give a general layout of my "skeleton" here. this shouls also serve as a basic episode page guide for all those who want to start

an example of the layout I'm going to use can be seen here in Episode #113. It isn't as elaborate as I wished, but since this is a skeleton article, it's good enough to serve more than its purpose.

Here, I have a few basics.

  • I have the title card as the main image of the page (and due to a glitch in the system, the only way to do it is up upload it first).
  • From there, I have put a title for the season, the Episode name in Romanji and Hiragana, and a synopsis of the episode.
  • The synopsis is a bit breifer than I wanted it to be, but I do hope to return to these episodes for an in-depth commentary/analysis later on.
  • occasionally, some screenshots of the episode might be added in if they can work with the synopsis, but that usually only happens when I do it in depth.
  • You may also want to add the credits for the Opening and Ending songs. these usually are placed at the very beginning or at the very end of the article.
  • afterwards, the characters are added, along with their voice actors(again, due to a glitch, you need to add the characters, save, then Re-Edit the page to put in the seiyus. also if you can't find a voice actor, feel free to add them to the database!).
  • from there, the credits, although this takes a long time, just adding Rumiko Takakashi as the writer is sufficient, and giving a full credit listing in the season finale seems to work well.
  • afterwards, you can add major objects and concepts in the episode, and then give the page one last checkover before submitting.

And that's it! from here, all that is needed is to expand the synopsis of the episode, add some relevant (and a few funny) screenshots, and you're done! now to do it for the other 160 episodes....

Anyways, That's it for now from me. To Taka and Kuro, I haven't forgotten about Rountable Discussion #10, I shall release it soon.

until then, Later!

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Hello everyone! This is the Roundtable User Discussion, where couple of AV users, like yourselves, virtually met up to talk anime, manga and other related topics. Read, comment, discuss and enjoy! Also, go back and read our other conversations (Here) and share your thoughts!

Fire Star(FS): Hello and welcome to the eight edition of the Roundtable discussions here at AV! I'm your host, Fire Star, and today, I have my fellow host Halberdierv2 with me to co-host. I hope everyone is ready for the great discussion tonight, because our topic is going to be in season, magic. Also, I have a few great and relatively new people here as well, please welcome Little_Socrates, Turambar and Hailnel. Before we go into our discussion though, let's start off with what are we doing currently as far as anime/manga is concerned? Me, I'm just starting to watch the Gosick series all the way through, I'm really excited for it. How about everyone else? Give yourself a little intro!

Ghost In The Shell
Ghost In The Shell

Little Socrates: Hey, happy to introduce myself! Lately, I haven't had a ton of time for anime thanks to my other Japanese courses, but I have been keeping up with the Persona 4 Animation and I've just begun the Ghost in the Shell manga. Having not seen the movie or a significant amount of Stand Alone Complex, I'm really enjoying it so far. I've also been on-and-off watching episodes of High School of the Dead with my roommate, commisar123.

OH! Also, I rewatched the first episode of Baka No Test with my roommate and a friend. That's still really stupid, but it's pretty entertaining, and seems to have appeal to people who don't know anime very well.

Baka No Test to Shoukanjuu!
Baka No Test to Shoukanjuu!

Hailinel: Hey, 'sup! Like Little_Socrates, I've been watching the Persona 4 anime and have been really enjoying it. I'm also in the middle of watching the entire run of Fist of the North Star. (And by "middle" I mean "episode 8 of 109.") I'm also prepping for a Halloween-themed anime night at my place this coming weekend, with Vampire Hunter D and Vampire Princess Miyu on tap.

Socrates : My roommate's a huge fan of the Fist of the North Star movie, but not because it was especially good. Lots of mention of reusing stock footage from the TV show, which sounds incredible. How's the longer-run series so far?

Hailinel: Violent and crazy. Kenshiro just wiped out an entire cult of Green Berets. My god.

Usagi Drop
Usagi Drop

Turambar: And jumping in late is me. I haven't had adequate time to make head ways into my back log of Revolutionary Girl Utena, Usagi Drops, and Legend of the Galactic Heroes, but I'm following Persona 4 on the currently airing anime front along with Gundam AGE. Manga wise, I'm slowly trudging through Five Star Stories, which I've been doing for half a year now.

Oh, and Fate/Zero. Definitely watching that.

HalV2: Good Evening Everyone! this is your co-host Hal! nice to be here this evening (despite me catching a cold no less than an hour ago!) tonight, we've got a special topic, so get ready to Sail under the Moon on Magical Girl night!

Sket-o Dance!
Sket-o Dance!

As for keeping up with anime, I've been keeping abreast of happenings over at Sket Dance, "the poor man's Gintama!" to quote Kagura (from Gintama). I've also started to look at Baka No Test season 1, and finding it hilarious! How are our guests this evening?

Hailinel: I'm doing great tonight.

Socrates: Yeah, I'm on top of the world today.

FS: Alright, so let's just jump right into it. First off, why do you think magic is prominent in manga and anime? For me, I think it is because it captures the imagination, and that is what anime is all about. Plus, it is also a common trend in other mediums, such as comics and games.

Hailinel: Well, magic is a very common, very convenient fantasy element that, as you said, very easily captures the imagination. It can be used to do just about anything.

Turambar: Magic is just an extension of the supernatural, which all cultures have embraced throughout history. It both captures the imagination and also helps explain the unexplainable. It's no surprise that it is so prominent in anime and manga along with pretty much every other medium. The fact that it's often extremely flashy and pretty helps too.

Socrates: As someone who's been focusing a LOT on Japanese literature over the last couple months, I can vouch for a longstanding tradition of the supernatural and magical in Japanese literature. The supernatural and magically religious has always captured the minds of the literate class; going back to The Tale of Genji, women die of supernatural causes all the time. Abe No Seimei (the man in my profile picture) resides in the Shuten Dōji scrolls as an "Onmyoji", one who practices a magical art known as "Onmyōdo." He's also regularly referred to as the first bishōnen.

The reason it is prevalent in anime and manga beyond American television (as I perceive it) is that magic and the supernatural is not necessarily considered a subgenre in the culture.That said, I think it's interesting to note how much more prevalent magic and the supernatural are in anime and manga compared to, say, American television, or even American television animation. It seems that the magical, whether used for comedy, action, or tension/horror, is of more disinterest to the American television community. There are, of course, exceptions; Fringe, Heroes, and Buffy all come to mind as examples, but I think most Americans consider magical shows "hokey." I think it's out of an unwillingness by the show's writers to take the magic they're creating especially seriously when they're being serious, something that gives many anime a lot more power.

Hal: Ok, in light of the topic of magic, let's focus on the topic of majou shojou (magical girls) for a moment. as much as they are an iconic staple of japanese anime culture, where should they fall storywise? they take prevelance in a Shōjo demographic, but should they be more skewered to Shōnen? Provide Examples of some Magical Girl Series you like!

Turambar: It can also be added that despite the big divide between Fantasy and Science Fiction genres, both can be said to explore the realm of magic in their own ways. They both tackle fantastical phenomenons, objects, and creatures, but simply with differing explanations for their creation and method of operation. After all, can anyone really say that the Turn-A Gundam's moonlight butterfly, despite being an attack composed of nanomachines, isn't pretty damned magical?

Well, I suppose one can say something like Nanoha is more of a shounen action show or a mecha show than anything else, haha. But something like Sailor Moon has always felt like wish fulfillment for girls more than a shounen (action) show.

@Socrates: Magic is definitely considered something for children, particularly if we're talking about magic in the realm of a mahou shoujo show. The West tackles the supernatural in terms of ghosts and vampires in mature fashions far more readily. Part of that can be pointed to the negative view that religion has given magic over the course of history.

However, I would like to point out that Science Fiction seems to be a far more popular genre in the West than in the East. As I said previously, something like Star Trek helps cover the human desire to imagine something greater and more fantastical.

Star: I think Magical Girls is a great concept for all mediums, but especially for Anime. I think they should stick to more shounen like shows, because, let's be real here, Sailor Moon had major success, and that show is exactly what I'm talking about. Though they have tried to copy a similar theme before, I think the shounen touch Sailor Moon had put it above all the rest.

Wedding Peach
Wedding Peach

Hailinel: I think that the genre is just fine for young girls. Wedding Peach is perfect for that demographic. It's light, fluffy, cute, largely non-violent, and covers a subject matter that's easy for children to digest. It also doesn't hurt that the protagonist Momoko, despite being a bit of a blockhead, isn't nearly as thick-headed as Usagi of Sailor Moon.

Of course, then there are the bonus episodes from the show's laser disc/DVD releases that directly parody two genres that skew toward boys; giant robots and sentai heroes. Those are just delightfully silly.

Socrates: I really have spent little time with the majou shojou genre; the experience I have is that as a child watching Sailor Moon, and during my reintroduction to anime I watched Yumeria (not a series I especially recommend.) It's not out of a dislike for the genre, I've just had very few recommendations other than Puella Magi Madoka Magica, which I've simply not gotten to yet.

However, compared to the traditional role for women in supernatural fiction (namely transforming into horrible demons as a response to strong jealousy/romantic feelings for monks) this new tradition is a lot more positive. I could not tell you who they were being aimed at demographically (and the ratio of innocence to fanservice in the genre) but I can say I'd be interested in seeing them skew towards shonen. I'm not entirely sure what the tone of the series would be (in my mind, it's like Those Who Hunt Elves in terms of comedy/quest, which is not a series I especially like) but if recommended I'd check it out.

Turambar: @Little_Socrates: Madoka is an interesting beast because despite being a mahou shoujo show, it aggressively voids many of the accepted tropes of the genre, the least of which being the existence of mahou shoujo is a good thing. Some have compared it to Evangelion in terms of how it rebels against its own genre. I wouldn't go that far, but a mahou shoujo show where the main character does not become one until the final episode is definitely not the norm.

The warrior of love and Justice, Sailor Moon!
The warrior of love and Justice, Sailor Moon!

Socrates: I'd agree, Turambar; I'd heard it was a deconstruction of the genre in a fashion similar to School Days or Evangelion. Deconstructions are wonderful, though (even if Evangelion's style was a bit too much for me) so I'm looking forward to checking it out.

Hailinel: I think that so much time has passed since the heyday of Sailor Moon and its ilk that it's natural that the generation that grew up influenced by mahou shoujo would want to put their own spin on things, whether that be through Madoka or something else.

Star: I think the only Magical Girl series that got some mega attention was Sailor Moon, it sort of "set the stage" for Magical Girl concepts everywhere.

Turambar: Actually, was there any mahou shoujo shows before Sailor Moon? While Sailor Moon certainly set the template for mahou shoujo shows to come, I wonder if different explorations into that genre was made before it, failed or otherwise.

Hailinel: True, Sailor Moon was the biggest and one of the longest lasting, which allowed it to really dictate the standards of the genre that would go on to be repeated elsewhere. It's in some ways no different from the way that Gundam gained influence over the giant robot genre, carving out a space for "real robots" in an age dominated by super robots.

Star: Do you think that most anime/manga have some magical concept in them, and if so, why?

Socrates: I wouldn't go that far, Star. Cardcaptor Sakura may have been before my time, but it was absolutely HUGE (not Sailor Moon/Naruto/Dragon Ball Z huge but huge nonetheless,) and I've seen people who are fans of Tokyo Mew Mew, D.N.Angel and Magical Girl Lyrical Nanoha. Also, I realized I have seen one other series with magical girls, that being Magic User's Club. Unfortunately, like Yumeria, that show is an entertaining bit of fluff, and I don't have much to say about it.

Sakura CardCaptors
Sakura CardCaptors

Personally, the characters that stick out the most in actual majou shojou series are the bishōnen. There's one who's slightly androgynous in Magic User's Club, and he was easily the most popular character in the anime club I watched it at (something around 30-40 viewers,) and I still consider dressing as Tuxedo Mask for Halloween even now. Other than Moon herself, I'm not even sure I could identify which Sailors were which! But I still remember the ridiculous way the Rangers would shout his name when he came onto the scene.

...though that may have been more of a realization of a poor dub than an actual sticking trait.

Hailinel: I think that most do, mainly because of the medium. It's much easier to depict magical and supernatural acts in an animated or drawn medium than it is in, say, a live-action TV. So while it's certainly possible for magical elements to appear in a live-action format, more creators have the freedom to pursue fantastic elements through anime and manga, even if the magical element is itself rather subdued.

Star I don't know, I think with the most attention Sailor Moon still had the biggest impact on the concept overall.

Turambar: As a prominent feature of the show, not necessarily. But almost all shows bend their knee to the supernatural in some small way, shape, or form. Take Lucky Star, a 4koma based show. It contains an episode that contains the spirit of one of the character's deceased mother.

Star: Good point, and I agree, I think if you look hard enough, magical concepts will be hidden in nearly every show somewhere.

Socrates: "Most" is a term I try to avoid. I don't follow the release of new series carefully enough to actually hear about what's coming out. That said, from the people I've met who are interested in anime, those with elements of the supernatural certainly seem to stick out the most to them. There's a subgroup of people I know who prefer science fiction in anime to the supernatural, but those people still enjoy both, so I'd still mark the supernatural as the "most popular."

In terms of anime discussion, the supernatural series are certainly the most popular for the same reason episodes of House merit more discussion than those of Desperate Housewives or Brothers & Sisters. There are two very distinct possibilities that can occur: either the supernatural elements cause things to change pretty drastically from episode to episode, or they allow for extremely long arcs that lead to a lot of tension and anticipation.

However, when I think of a lot of the first series I watched when I first delved into the world of subs, their supernatural elements were, at best, limited: Futakoi, Shuffle! (in its non-filler arcs,) School Days, and a couple others had next to zero supernatural elements to them. In that way, they were kind of special to me.

Hal: ok, In Relation To the question I posed, I do think Magic girls are a mostly shojou concept aimed at girls mainly (Sailor moon, cure peach, etc) but a few have crossed the border to be appealing for both shojou and shonen (sailor moon (again), Sakura Cardcaptors). however, i do wish there were some distinctly shonen Majou shojou shows that would be substance, and not using the girls as fanservice.

as for star's question, i disagree with the statement as is written, but I think i get the angle its trying to approach. many recent and popular shonen and shojou shows that have been produced in the last 10-20 years have some fantasy element in them, which in one way or another has been copied from one show to another. look at the "Shonen Jump Pillars" of Naruto, Bleach and One Piece. all of those are pure fantasy and incorporate some sense of magic into their storyline that fits well (the magical jutsus, Kido and Hado, the Devil fruit powers, etc). many other shows (FullMetalAlchemist is a big example) run with some variation of magic as its main plot, and would execute it to various degrees of efectiveness.

Hailinel: To go back to the show I mentioned at the very start, Fist of the North Star, even that is, in itself, a magical show. The characters practice martial arts comprised of physically impossible techniques that could in their own way be considered a form of magic despite the overall tone of the show. It's one of the main elements that separates it from other Mad Max-like post-apocalypse worlds; characters that have mastered arts capable of physically destroying a human body with a simple touch.

Turambar I think it really just depends on what you consider makes a shounen show a, well, shounen show. For me, a shounen show predicates on flashy action that appeals to your average teen or tween male. It can certainly build ontop of that, but that is the bedrock of what makes shows in that genre popular. In that sense, a mahou shoujo show that appeals to the shounen crowd is easy. In fact, I'd say Nanoha pretty much has already done it.

Turambar: Going off the previous question then, what do you think is a good method of mixing magical elements into non-magical shows? And do any shows or franchises pose as a good example of it?

Socrates: Well, I hate to bring up Persona 4...

Haruhi Suzumiya no Yuutsu
Haruhi Suzumiya no Yuutsu

Nah, I'd be lying if I ever said that. Persona 4's best parts are often non-magical, though I wouldn't say that about the anime. The same goes for The Melancholy of Haruhi Suzumiya. Essentially, the rule of the day is to let the supernatural elements serve as your levity when you want to tell a more serious story. The supernatural allows the creator of these show to explore many themes at once while binding it all to a supernatural narrative, and as a result the show allows lovable characters to engage in a WIDE range of tones, situations, and subtexts.

Star :I think one of the best ways is a supporting character with magical abilities, it is the easiest way to be known, yet not too over the top.

Turambar: I personally feel that the magical element needs to be laid on in a very broad stroke. I have two preferred examples of this. The first being the original SDF Macross. The magical element in that show is laid on top of the broad concept of culture shock and exchange. The Zentradi, a warrior race, are defeated and pacified through the power of song that stimulates their senses in a way they never have before. The power of music is taken to even greater degrees with Macross 7 where song becomes a more literal weapon compared to SDF-Macross where it was more conceptual. Demystification and "scientific" explanations of this element in the show is possible, but the entire presentation of it is given a very fantastical and magical touch that does not need some "love beam" to pull through.

Hailinel: I think Xenosaga: The Animation really did a fine job in that regard. The show is based off of a video game in which characters had a number of special attacks that obviously fantastic. The character MOMO can even learn a mahou shoujo transformation. In the anime, these sorts of elements obviously couldn't be used, because while being able to jump thirty feet in the air and kick a meteor at your enemy is a neat attack, the logic of the actual story doesn't normally make that possible.

The one exception to this rule is an episode in which a number of characters delve into another character's consciousness. While present within this mental space, the laws of normal reality don't apply, and thus they're able to be more creative and do things that they wouldn't normally be capable of.

As another example, there's Azumanga Daioh, which is as down-to-earth as they come in many respects. But things get fantastically weird when the show delves into the dreams of the characters. Once again, the events don't violate any natural laws of their mundane reality, but it allows the cast to experience the bizarre.

NewType Gundam
NewType Gundam

@Turambar: On a similar track, there's also Gundam and the idea of the Newtype. The idea of exposure to outer space eventually allowing humanity to evolve into a state of being with a sixth sense is a fantastic element in itself, but in Zeta Gundam particularly, the interaction of Kamille's power and his emotionality take the notion of the sixth sense into the realm of magical, or almost magical, as it empowers the Zeta Gundam beyond what would normally be thought possible.

Turambar:

whoops, pressed post too early there.

The second of which is Gundam. The concept of the superior human being, the Newtype, exists throughout the entire franchise, and is praised as more than just the next step of human evolution, but as something transcendental, almost god like. With their powers to do stuff like contact the spirits of the dead (zeta gundam), it's not hard to see how newtypes have been given a somewhat magical touch. But what I really love about Gundam was that the franchise critiqued itself with Gundam X. It critiqued the characters that worshiped newtypes like gods, and critiqued newtypes that thought themselves as transcendent beings. It was a very meta moment that I definitely appreciated.

Hahaha, you pretty much read my mind there Hailinel.

Hailinel: Indeed!

Hal: With the popularity of magic-related themes in manga now, do you think this will be a core theme that will never run out of popularity, or will it just eventually fade away like some of the fads in the past (like mechas, zombies, etc)?

Hailinel: I don't know if it will ever really wane in popularity simply because there are so many ways for magic to be depicted, whether it be straight high fantasy (Record of Lodoss War), modern/urban fantasy (X, Haruhi Suzumiya), horror (Hell Girl, Vampire Princess Miyu), or mahou shoujo. Magic simply comes in so many flavors that when one wanes in popularity, it's easy for another to take its place.

Star: I think it may loose some of it's "luster" per se, but I don't think it will every really diminish.

Turambar: I'd hardly say mecha is a fad given the sheer breadth of that genre, but yes, magic will be something that will never run out of popularity. Magic has had a hold on human imagination for thousands of years, and I don't see it losing that grip anytime soon. Even the magic specific genre wanes, as previously shown, its a theme that will still find its way into plenty of other shows out there.

Hal: alright guys, its about time to wrap up. thank you for a rousing discussion this evening! care to say any last words before we leave?

Star: Thanks for having me, as always it's a pleasure and fun. As Sora would say, "I'm signing out!"

Turambar: And always be piloting giant robots!

Hailinel: Sorry to not to tell you guys before now, but everyone that read this round table is already dead.

Until next time!

Socrates: With that, unfortunately, I have to sign off! It's been fun, everybody; I hope to be back next time.

Hal: this is your Co-host Hal signing out for the night. see you next time!

See you, Space Cowboy

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AV's Roundtable User Discussion 008 - Crossovers

Hello everyone! This is the Roundtable User Discussion, where couple of AV users, like yourselves, virtually met up to talk anime, manga and other related topics. Read, comment, discuss and enjoy! Also, go back and read our other conversations (Here) and share your thoughts!

I am your host, HalberdierV2, and welcome to the Eighth Roundtable Discussion! today we have the thoughtful insights of Obsidian609, the legendary ZombiePie and sage Hailinel! Today's topic is something that's bound to be exciting, Crossovers in Anime!

Say hello, guys!

Hailinel: 'Sup! I've been into anime since high school about fifteen years ago, though I haven't seen much of the latest shows out there. My tastes are mostly locked in a time capsule that got sealed some time around 2003. I created my Anime Vice account when the site launched, but it was only recently that I started coming here as a more frequent user. I guess if you want to know more about me, there's also this blog post I wrote.

ZombiePie: Hello Anime Vice! It's good to be back being involved with the Community features.

Obsidian609:Hello and thank you for having me tonight.

Ok guys, before we get down to business and Brass Tacks, what have you been up to, Manga and Anime-wise?

Obsidian:The only thing I have been watching is Blood-C right now. As for manga I have just been reading D.Gray-Man, Yozakura Quartet and xxxHolic

Zombie: I finished up Tiger & Bunny in line with Tom's articles and am looking forward to the second season of Squid Girl.

Hailinel: Last Sunday, I decided to sit down and watch a bunch of older anime. Some I had seen before, some I hadn't. The first of what I hadn't seen was Ayane's High Kick. An OVA so obscure that it's apparently not even in the site's database. Two episodes of ridiculous sports-comedy and a character that's like B-ko crossed with Sagat from Street Fighter.

Cyber City Oedo 808
Cyber City Oedo 808

The other anime I hadn't seen was the three-episode OVA Cyber City. It's really fun, though it really doesn't go very deep into the characters. It feels like a three-episode TV pilot that never really got off the ground. Three very well animated, action-packed episodes, but just like AHK above, it left me wanting more when this is all we got.

As for what I had seen before, this was seriously the first time I had seen Gall Force: Eternal Story andOdin: Photon Space Sailor Starlight in roughly a decade and a half. Neither is really at the top of their genre, but the rose tinting I may have had for them actually didn't distort too much. It was a fun day.

Obsidian: Wow, heck of a day. I think the only anime I have watched on your list was Gall Force: Eternal Story years ago on the Sci Fi Channel. Don't remember the dialog too well.

Hailinel: Honestly, I was surprised by how much I did remember as I watched it.

Okay, guys. here's a topic rarely touched on in Anime culture. Crossovers! do you think that crossovers are a good Idea in specifically manga?

Hailinel: In manga? Well, I think they'd be good for the occasional event. It would be interesting to see the artists do takes on the characters of other series, but I'd probably prefer it if I didn't have to buy multiple books from the series that are crossing with each other. Having to read two or three separate series to keep up with the story is much more cumbersome than a single event manga volume or series. (It's also easier on the wallet).

Dragon Ball / One Piece
Dragon Ball / One Piece
Fairy Tail / Rave Master
Fairy Tail / Rave Master

Obsidian: Hmm crossover in manga's. I haven't read too many other than the Dragon Ball - One Piece and the Fairy Tail - Rave Master crossovers. Seeing how they weren't that long they didn't really cover much as to the reasons for the crossover especially the Fairy Tail / Rave Master one. I think it is possible if they make a good plot for the crossover.

Zombie: I have really fond memories of when DC and Marvel created Amalgam Comics and did a bunch of specials where they would combine characters into new ones like Dr. Doomsday (which was Doomsday and Dr. Doom), Dark Claw (which was Wolverine and Batman), and Super Soldier (which was Captain America and Superman). It was crazy and super looney but with crossovers unless you are really careful it has to be non-canonical and kind of a joke that appeases the curiosity of hardcore fans.

Obsidian: Yeah, Amalgam did do some crazy crossovers. But I agree, they should be non-canonical and kind of a joke that appeases the curiosity of hardcore fans.

Hailinel: I totally missed out on that era of western comics. Amalgam sounds utterly crazy. Though, I do disagree on keeping them non-canonical. I think that there are certain cases where, if treated right, the events of a crossover can be maintained within the separate continuities. It depends on how the effects of the crossover are handled.

Hal: I remember reading about Amalgum's comics and thinking how loony their universes must be from all that character fusing.

I think as long as there is some similarites between scenarios within two (or more) manga's there's always the room for a great crossover. now how well do you think the ideas of a manga crossover would translate over to Anime?

Hailinel: If we're talking about crossovers from different production teams, I think that the best option for any anime crossover in that sense would be for a movie of some sort, or a TV/video special. The crossover would be best kept contained within itself, or at least constrained to a single series, rather than across two or more. TV logistics are just a different beast when compared to the way print works.

Zombie: I know there are CLAMP fans out there that are yelling at me furiously, at the top of their lungs, saying that crossovers can be serious and genuinely impactful to the story of both products, but in the end CLAMP pays the price with the manner in which they do their crossovers. All of their stories require a massive investment on the part of the audience. You have to know and keep up with everything in order to understand anything. It's honorable that they put in that much effort to add that interconnectedness, but in the end it muddles every story they tell and makes them sometimes unnecessarily complex and inaccessible to new viewers. Which is why I say generally writers should try to limit things to non-canonical specials.

Obsidian: I see what you mean there ZompiePie. I think Blood-C might be a crossover with xxxHolic which was probably not the best way to crossover with. Come to think of it there was a Detective Conan/Lupin III crossover which did considerably well and was entertaining.

Hailinel: I disagree, ZombiePie. Though I'm not familiar with all of CLAMP's crossovers, their crossover between Tokyo Babylon and X requires minimal investment. It certainly helps to be familiar with the Tokyo Babylon characters, but the storyline of X is such that reading Tokyo Babylon isn't really a requirement to understand the relationship between the characters, as by that point, they're more or less focused on ending each other.

Hal: I agree with your point on CLAMP, Zombie ,especially with the Tsubasa series, which seems to have become the hub for all of the clamp crossovers, and is really complex, confusing, and I've kept my head out of it. Also, the production may have suffered more problems outside of Japan. imagine trying to do a crossover in the US, especially considering the corporate culture to each other! (probably explains why JUMP! ultimate Stars never saw the light of day in English..)

Obsidian: Yeah, such a shame they never translated that game. I should have bought the import when I saw it at Best Buy years ago.

An interesting point you've led to, Zombie, the concept of multiverses. judging by both the ups and downs of the CLAMPverse, as a mangaka, what do you think are the best ways to go about constructing a multiverse now, and what ones do you think are good examples?

CLAMP
CLAMP

Zombie: Again I have to go back to comics and mention a stupid crazy one that I really enjoyed which is Marvel Zombies. Beyond that I have to be perfectly honest and say that the one's I like or am excited about are the ones that match two perfectly similar but different enough products. The announcement of the One Piece x Toriko, even though I'm not entirely absorbed by either manga/anime, when it was announced I felt that it was perfect and could be a potentially great multiverse.

Hailinel: I think the best example would be Leiji Matsumoto's space opera of a universe. At the core, there are a few key characters, like Captain Harlock, Emeraldas and Maetel, but the stories that they're involved in can exist independent of one another. You don't need to be familiar with Harlock to enjoy Galaxy Express 999, for example.

To create a good universe like this, it really helps to understand how these stories are connected from the start. So when the time comes for an event where characters from two works are put in a position to meet each other, it feels natural, and not just a gimmick.

Obsidian: Yeah, Leiji Matsumoto's universe is epic. I agree that you don't have to be familiar with the characters series to enjoy his works.

Okay, moving on a bit, or should I say, moving back. there are some of the older cross overs that took place that were well received, such as Cross Epoch (DragonBall and One Piece), DBZ and Dr Slump. do you think there are any lessons that could be learned from these old attempts at crossing over?

Hailinel: I'm not really too familiar with any of those crossovers, so I can't really say what could be learned from them.

Obsidian: I only read Cross Epoch, I thought the characters' match-ups worked perfectly for the story.

Zombie: Yeah, with the Dr. Slump and Dragon Ball crossover Goku visited Penguin Village in a filler episode. Again it was a nice little nod to dedicated fans of Akira Toriyama's work. For people that started with Dragon Ball and had never heard of Dr. Slump it didn't prevent them from enjoying the rest of the series and was utterly harmless.

Obsidian: Oh yeah, I forgot about that filler episode, and it was as you said, utterly harmless.

Hailinel: That sounds interesting. I'll have to see about tracking that down.

Obsidian: Episode 55 started that filler crossover Hailinel, if you were wondering.

Speaking of filler, have you seen anything in the past few years in either anime or manga that could have/should have been crossed over, but was an opportunity missed for some awesomeness? there's a Naruto filler ongoing with him sailing over the sea, and is in dire need for a visit by the Straw Hat Pirates.

Zombie: In the end cross epochs are like the Christmas Special of a show or book. Utterly mindless and probably created with the intention of making more money. Almost every single time I have heard them I've avoided them because they end up being a waste of a perfectly good plot and are aimed at the lowest common denominator.

Hailinel: Too much time really passed in between to let these two cross over, but am I the only one that thinks a mix of Hell Girl and Vampire Princess Miyu would not be both potentially fitting with each other, as well as awesome? You've got the creepy girls and their helpers mixing it up with foolish mortals. What else do you need?

WHAT ELSE DO YOU NEED?

Obsidian: Hmm good point and I would watch it.

Zombie: I remember Kunihiko Ikuhara saying that he wants to collaborate with David Lynch some day. So here's what I propose...Twin Peaks and Mawaru Penguindrum merge together and create an incomprehensible, batshit crazy, awesome show. How awesome would that be? I mean they could have David Lynch co-direct an episode of whatever Ikuhara is working on and it would still be pretty much the same show. It would be perfect.

Hailinel: I'm pretty sure you could tell someone that David Lynch directed Revolutionary Girl Utena: The Movie, and sound legitimately convincing.

Here's something I've been personally wondering... of the three main franchises in JUMP in Japan (Naruto/Bleach/One Piece), why do you think there hasn't been any manga/anime crossover in any story between themselves yet?, or, more realistically, at least an attempt?

Naruto / Bleach / One Piece
Naruto / Bleach / One Piece

Hailinel: Naruto/Bleach/One Piece? Well, I guess the main question would be, how would you realistically fit them together without it clashing severely? True, they're all shows with supernatural elements and action, but there's no really easy way to connect these together for any sort of crossover without a ludicrous contrivance of some sort because the worlds they inhabit are so different.

Obsidian: Very true on that part.

Zombie: Those properties are so big that a crossover would require a lot of careful attention. It could be an amazing and impressive piece of work but all bets are that it isn't and it would just be a violently out-of-control megacrossover where sources are thrown together with no regard to blending their continuities. At that point you probably just convince yourself it's best to not cross the streams.

Hal: well, that's what filler's for, to make one-shot episodes with no bearing on the actual story of the manga, and to have some fun.

Hailinel: That's true, but when they go wrong, they can go very wrong. Like bad fanfiction, only done by the original creators.

Zombie: So again we get back to my point that generally crossovers should be non-canonical. I bet it has to be with the author's not willing to work or viewing themselves as rivals and not companions with each other...I mean you think about the money they could make on such a crossover but it still hasn't happened there has to be a major reason. Then again I could be off on that one.

Hal: hmm, true, although mangakas really don't make all that much compared to western animators.

One last thing. If you could see two animes crossing over that you believe would complement each other, and haven't crossed over before, what would they be?

Zombie: Gundam and something moe...SCIENCE!

Hailinel: That would compliment each other? I could cop out and suggest Hell Girl/Miyu again, but how about some action between You're Under Arrest and Patlabor? That'd really shake Natsumi and Miyuki's traffic duty up a bit.

What? Don't give me that. They're both cop shows. It fits.

Obsidian: Huh. Tough to say on that one. I probably wouldn't be able think of any good ones like you, Hailinel.

Alright guys, we've had quite the discussion tonight, and some good points were thrown around. care to say a few parting words to the audience before we leave, guys?

Hailinel: It was a fun discussion. But if I have any final thought, it is this: "You may cross your anime, your manga, and the street, but never the streams."

Good night, everybody!

Zombie: Don't be too open minded about crossovers because if you're too open minded, your brains will fall out.

Obsidian: Huh that was good. Good night everyone!

Hal: Good Night everyone, see you at Roundtable Discussion #009!

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Hey everyone,
Im sending out a notice to tell you to look out for a blog coming your way next week from me.
 
With Anime Expo going on, we've got Tom and Geo doing the honors of bringing AnimeVice the know-all about it throughout the weekend in LA.
but what's this? another Anime convention is going on! The 2nd annual AnimeKon in Barbados is also going on, July 2-3.  In case you're wondering, yes, that same Barbados known as a Sea, Sand and Sun destination in the middle of the Caribbean, is getting into the anime scene. I've got a weekend pass, and will be letting you in on the know-how. we've even got DC comics coming in for sponsorship! so I'll be bloggin on this new convention next week.
 
also, about the time this is  posted, the final episode of Gosick is airing in Japan.  I've got the wiki project almost done ( I still have to go back and clean up the earlier episodes) and I'm also shouting out for some help in that area again.
 
That is all, see you next time!
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 well, for those who are following the series, its drawing to its close soon, with only a handful of episodes remaining till the end, its getting more and more intense each episode, with some murder mystery moments interrupted with occasional funny breaks and more prevelant recently, heavy action sequences and a dramatic story involving Victorique's village and her past.
 
 I've done some episodes in detail in the past, and as the ending draws near, the episodes get more intense and action-packed, and require a lot more info on them. a good example is Episode 18 here, which took (albeit broken up a lot) 7 hours and over 50 screenshots, which shows it takes a while to get a quality product done.
 These Guys have it rough..
 These Guys have it rough..

 
Im just asking for some help with ese episodes, and the writeup, especially as it draws to a close, a solid ending writeup will be a great thing for the wiki, and encourage people to build up other articles.
so how's about sending off this great show with a bang, eh, Animevice?
 
or do I have to convince you otherwise... I mean, no one's pointing a gun at you or anything.....
 
 
 Psych.
 Psych.
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