Gremmy tries to imagine a scenario where he's a well written character and the fullbring arc wasn't a waste of time. He blows up.
Gremmy tries to imagine a scenario where he's a well written character and the fullbring arc wasn't a waste of time. He blows up.
Chouji takes a half of the opponents, Neji takes the rest. Overall Konoha nins are too fast for the Homonculi, with the exception of Pride. Shino and Shikamaru stomps him.
Guessing you mean post-time skip, and don't forget about their regen.
under the right circumstances pride stomps them all
wrath reflex is faster than a stream of bullets and greeds armour is supposed to be indestructible.
and envy IMO is at least as strong as a tailed beast
...as strong as a tailed beast? Don't know about that, tailed beasts are mountain level (Shukaku being the only possible exception).
The homunculi are sent by Father to destroy a Leaf hideout. It is guarded by the Konoha 11 (with the exception of Naruto and Lee, who are both on other missions, hence Konoha 9).
Round 1: pre-timeskip Konoha 9 and 20 generic ninja (chunnin) vs the homunculi, and the ninja have an hour of prep (but still no knowledge).
Round 2: post-timeskip Konoha 9 vs the homunculi and 30 regular soldiers with rifles.
Fight takes place in a forest.
Who wins in which rounds?
(Picture's really small, not sure why)
To make things clear, this is: Shikamaru, Ino, Kiba, Hinata, Shino, Choji, Sakura, Tenten and Neji vs the 7 homunculi.
@Whats_out_the_bag: Except your comparison doesn't work, in that sense, as we can't power scale for Lucifer from anyone who would be on that level.
Cheers for the info and the tier list, but it feels like we're going in circles here. Buu can't erase Lucifer (I'd be happy for a stalemate, I've changed that much), but I'm still not convinced that Lucy could eliminate Buu, based on the feats given so far. As before, you say he's nigh-omnipotent, but could he warp galaxies? Turn the sun into chocolate? Turn the milky way in on itself? It goes back to what I said originally.
I'm leaving this one, in my mind it's a stalemate, but feel free to continue posting if you want.
Obito: Katon nuke, gedo mazo
Madara: A single meteor can wipe out everyone, if not he can also katon nuke, World of Flowering, god help them if he decides to use PS
Naruto: Bijuudama GG battlefield
All three can solo with minimal difficulty.
Definitely this. Madara especially, who could activate PS and then read a book for a while (wouldn't matter, none of their attacks could do jack shit to him).
@Bruce246: Bear in mind that the 3rd Raikage was able to hold off an army of 10,000 ninja for 3 days by himself. If he could do that, imagine what this team could do.
@Whats_out_the_bag: Ok, so in their true state, Lucy isn't physical, is that it? If so, how is it that he can 'roast the earth' in a battle, not being physical?
Thanks for the example of dimension forming. When I say 'leagues above them', let me put it this way: I just have trouble seeing a being that, alone, was a threat to the entire universe and was systematically nuking planets for giggles losing to someone who has never done anything beyond earth (that I'm aware of).
'Any being stronger than an Angel'...doesn't Lucifer pop their heads off whenever he feels like it? I heard that you needed archangel weapons to harm Lucifer anyway.
Imo he can win against all except possibly Garurumon.
How does he win against Darth Maul? The guy could force choke him to death, or just force toss him aside before he got anywhere near him.
How does he win against Green Goblin, who singlehandedly is able to give Spiderman a lot of trouble? I don't see him beating Dumbledore either, if he creates a massive lasso of fire (a la Half-blood Prince) then he isn't getting close, plus the wizard has far more experience and a lot more tricks up his sleeve.
Maybe I'm missing something, is Tiger meant to be super fast? I don't remember anyone having super speed in Monster Rancher (not supersonic and above, anyway). As it is, I don't even see how an argument could be made for him beating those three.
And how exactly is he meant to beat a dragon either...?
The entire Supernatural seems like arguing a NLF in vs-Battles.
only feats lucifer/michael has: affecting beings weaker than them.
So can Lucifer destroy Superman, Silver Surfer, Thanos, Marvel thor,Marvel odin, Mephistopheles, Average non-hungry Galactus etc?
And JBA GER = JoJo's Bizarre Adventure Gold Experience Requiem.
Precisely what I was arguing. If guy A has the ability to vaporise a human with a click of his fingers, that doesn't mean he can vaporise a cosmic entity just as easily.
........... this was a spite thread
This is going to be boring. You've been here too long to be making post like that.
@GIRUGAMESH:Set the earth on fire? Yeah, I've heard that before- and so what? Freiza was a casual planet buster
And that's supposed to be impressive? What is that doing in this battle? Nothing., I don't remember Lucifer doing anything like that.
Why does he have to?Kill Buu with a snap of the fingers? Sorry, nope. When has that ability worked on anyone on Buu's level?
Buu's level? Please don't feed me that bull shit. What's wrong with you people and these this character has better DC thus he can't be killed by anyone with lower DC. Do you not read any fiction?
Please tell me you meant in terms of regeneration as that would be the molecular attack a moment ago . Then I would reply with he can pretty much snap to use any of his abilities.I suppose Gremmy from Bleach could solo DBZ if he wanted too.
Oh cute you're trying to compare Gremmy to Lucifer. Just because they both share this reality warping ability, doesn't mean they are on the same level. Gremmy's best feat was creating a small meteorite. Lucifer is capable of creating dimensions.
Also if Gremmy's reality warping powers were actually good, then yes he could solo DBZ. A powerful reality warper can do what they want, when they want.You seem to be guilty of throwing no limit fallacies around here, saying that they can do 'pretty much anything' isn't proof of universal reality warping or anything on that level.
Universal Reality warping. Oh you mean range?
Not sure about that, but I can go and check later for you. But he really doesn't need anything on that scale. A small range will do. He's displayed enough to handle buu.As far as hurting him goes, destroying his body is usually acceptable in cases like this. As long as we accept that, Lucy is apparently screwed.
No it isn't. Please bring up some examples of when destroying the body is acceptable? LET me show you something from the rules "Winner must kill(if possible) or KO the opponent."
See that IF POSSIBLE thing there. Which it isn't for Buu. .As long as we accept that, Lucy is apparently screwed.
And since when does your opinion on who you think is screwed matters here?
Actually, a lot of fiction (particularly in manga/anime, but also in comics) suggests that character A's abilities are less effective against character B if that character is leagues above them. It's kind of one of the unwritten laws, the kind of thing that stops devilman taking down Freiza, and Gremmy soloing the Bleachverse (they would just say 'reiatsu cancels it' or something to that effect). I could give you dozens of examples, but I'm sure you've read enough to know what I'm talking about.
I'm glad you referred to my example with Gremmy though- looks like you're actually starting to give me feats now. So Lucifer can create dimensions? Awesome, can you give examples? Or be more specific? Because 'creating dimensions' can vary massively in terms of power and scale (e.g. is it a pocket dimension, like Obito's, or a whole separate universe?). The reason I mention Gremmy alongside Lucy is that I wasn't aware of any major feats of his that would put him so far above the sternritter.
But no, I wasn't referring to range- scale and range are two different things. And you say 'he's displayed enough'. Cool, that's what I'm asking for- what has he done? As I said, you know more about the show than I do. The only feats I know of for him are 'scorching the earth' as a side effect of a full-power battle and blowing off people's heads, neither of which are enough to beat Buu.
I used the example of 'killing the body' from my own experience of threads like these. In another thread, a guy was arguing that Gandalf stalemates Goku because Gandalf's spirit would survive. I had the same logic in mind here (you're right about the OP, though). Could you explain Lucifer's durability to me, and the deal with his host possession?
This clearly isn't a religious debate as this is from the series.
Also a battle between them would cause the earth to be in flames.based on DC feats lucifer doesn't even register as a threat in DBZ.
I know you must be new the battle forms and all, but you should know DC isn't the only way to win a battle.
Lucifer can snap his fingers and kill buu on a molecular level.
He's a reality warper. His little brother ( which it's stated that Lucifer taught him everything he knows) can create black holes, different dimensions where he once put the main character in a TV LAND like world.
Angels have the power to stop time, and time travel.
What would anyone in DBZ do to Lucifer? He doesn't have a physical body for them to hurt, he also can regenerate from anything ( his vessel form). He doesn't have a soul, yet he can soul fuck and mind fuck.
@GIRUGAMESH:what has Lucifer ever done to put him remotely close to Buu?
In terms of DC he hasn't done much. But Angels are very powerful and fast. He has no way of hurting Lucifer, while Lucy as billions of ways to kill him.
Set the earth on fire? Yeah, I've heard that before- and so what? Freiza was a casual planet buster, I don't remember Lucifer doing anything like that.
Kill Buu with a snap of the fingers? Sorry, nope. When has that ability worked on anyone on Buu's level? I suppose Gremmy from Bleach could solo DBZ if he wanted too. You seem to be guilty of throwing no limit fallacies around here, saying that they can do 'pretty much anything' isn't proof of universal reality warping or anything on that level.
As far as hurting him goes, destroying his body is usually acceptable in cases like this. As long as we accept that, Lucy is apparently screwed.
Based on hype? Mihawk would likely give him a good fight, but still lose.
Based on feats? Kenpachi has a bit of fun and then crushes him.
To give people some idea, I rank Mihawk as being firmly admiral level (based on feats and hype), but Kenpachi is a member of Bleach's top tier, as it stands (alongside Current/Dangai Ichigo, Bach, Yammamoto and Hogyoku Aizen). I don't see him losing this.
Lucifer wins. He's too strong for Buu.
Interesting, because when last I checked, Lucifer wasn't even planet level. Supernatural tends to get far too much support from some.
You probably know the show better than I do, though- what has Lucifer ever done to put him remotely close to Buu?
@taichokage: We don't know if he can turn a whole body(especially one as big as the juubi) into a cookie. His powers are proven to have limitations, so its kinda hard to debate about this guy beyond what he has shown without sounding like no-limit-fallacy.
EDIT: Even if all the juubi bones are broken that probably won't kill it. As it seems that pieces of chakra from the bjiuu still possess a conscious as shown in the past chapters.
Turning it into a cookie might work? Incredible raw power alone, no matter who is irrelevant next to reality warping even at a small-medium scale as long as both parties are serious. Gremmy is a fool in character but bloodlusted there is no issue.
Reckon he could turn Galactus into a cookie as well? How about Goku? Unwritten law of manga/anime #11: if character A is on a level well beyond character B, it doesn't matter what character B's power is, they still lose. I accept that it often doesn't make sense, but in practice it applies in a lot of cases.
If Gremmy tried turning Kenpachi into a cookie now in the manga, it would probably say 'it didn't work, his reiatsu is just too damn high'. If they had sent Gremmy to take down Yammamoto via cookie transformation? 'Sorry, the reiatsu was too damn high'.
Round 1: pre- Itachi fight CM Sasuke
round 2: pre- Hokage summit MS SasukeRaiden Mid diff
round 3: Post Kabuto fight EMS sasuke vs All Game equipment RaidenSasuke Mid diff
round 4: current EMS sasuke vs All game equipment RaidenSasuke stomps
The team has the hax to take down Madara, but if Madara hits any of them it's over.
The Team. Madara will get overwhelmed.
Mads really needs more feats. Madara before he got the jinchuuriki's power should have been strong enough to take on 2 admirals, with the Juubi's power he should be able to win against all 3 (I put the 3 admirals, Akoji, Kizaru and Akainu, above these guys). But it feels like the difference between Madara before the juubi's power and his current form isn't that great...
Isn't the argument for Bleach vs Naruto threads that nobody can see or sense Bleach characters, therefore they can just walk up and stab people freely with nobody being able to do anything?
Fortunately few people are dumb enough to make that point, as the thread becomes irrelevant.
Lizard beats standard all the way to 7th gate, all though the last one is notably difficult. 8th gate and guy damn near stomps with intange off.
But even if Gai serious, that doesn't mean he'll go straight for 8 gates, or even 7 gates. Way I see it, he'd have to go to 7 gates to put up a good fight against Kizaru, and if he doesn't, then he runs the risk of Kizaru putting a laser through his head. In most scenarios I see Kizaru killing him or doing too much damage for Gai to bring it back.
For now I'll say Kizaru wins 7.5/10. The other 2.5 is for if Gai goes straight for 7 gates or higher (7 gates would be close to or arguably equal Kizaru, 8 gates would crush him).