There's a big difference of power here and TTGL is on another level entirely.
No, actually Asura should be a large star-buster (in destructor mode) considering that he was able to punch through Chakravartin, and Chakra's likely over several times the size of our sun in scale to it, since he was floating over it and he was considerably larger than it. I also recall Chakravartin using a Rigul (a large blue sun) in the fight that you had to destroy. Then again, not sure if that was in a cutscene or a game-play mechanic. Been a while since I played it.
Nevertheless. TTGL should still win this match easily.
Nathaniel Grey (X-Man). He has powerful molecular manipulation that he can use to make himself intangible/untouchable, and he can use it to disassemble Goku on the atomic level. An alternate and weaker version of himself (Cable), could do the same to destroy the Silver Surfer's board.
You're both so very good at the whole denial thing.
They created a pocket dimension.
That was likely the size of a universe and they had complete control over it. It had stars, galaxies, et ceterea.
Not a big deal. Jedah does that in Darkstalkers. The Nobility in VHD made tons of them. Magic users in Warcraft lore do it as well. Chakravartin did it in Asura's Wrath. Mundus did it in DMC1. It's not some super-powerful ability. It's cool to have, but you're taking it out of proportion. And the "Multiverse labyrinth" is BS. It's not physical. It was a mental attack that they didn't even escape on their own merit. Also, Spiral energy didn't turn Will into reality. It turned Will into Energy and that into Matter. Not all that impossible. It's a form of energy/matter manipulation.
Blah blah blah. More baseless claims. Blah blah blah.
Seriously, it's like you don't know the definition of warping reality.
Definition: "It is the ability to reshape matter and energy, create or alter life forms, turn a person's thoughts or desires into reality, simulate any and all other powers and abilities, bend time and space, and possibly even rewrite the laws of physics."
Many of these abilities were exhibited by both the Anti-Spiral and TTGL in their fight, and it was also exhibited in the SGGL fight. The only way you could say otherwise is if you haven't watched the series and don't know what you're even talking about, which you don't.
The infinite power argument has been done. Asura has it too. And he's not just a battery. He's the weapon, the machine, the source, all in one. He's the Hindu Hulk.
Yeah, Asura's cool and all that but you can't use your opinion as proof that he has infinite power. He has a lot of power and it has shown to grow with his anger but just like the Hulk he has his limits. We have to go by feats here.
Also, I didn't say infinite power in regards to spiral energy. I said that it grew endlessly until it reaches spiral nemesis and destroys the universe. That's it limit. It can't go beyond universal in destructive capacity. It's not multiversal.
Yeah, but we're talking about someone who moves thousands of kilometers per second. Her combat speed should be around that, considering that she can maneuver and control herself at those speeds; even if it was just close or somewhere near it, it would still be way too fast for Ichigo. Plus, Buffy can just ram into Ichigo at that speed. There's no way Ichigo is dodging or countering that.
Both Wonder Woman and Superman are super-fast, and have dozens of great movement/reaction feats. However, that is also unrelated to what I was saying. You guys are missing the point.
How can a character move from one specific part of the planet to the next without having the reactions/reflexes to know where they are going? Have you tried running or flying from New York to Florida in a second, under your own power? You think a normal human being can keep up with themselves at that speed and see where they are going? No. Things will be too fast for them to even process. That's why they have to have the reactions/reflexes to keep up with themselves so they can know and control where they are going. Common sense, people.
Clearly you failed to understand what was being said. I will simplify; Travel Speed =/= Combat Reaction
No. I understand that you were trying to say that. What I don't understand is why you haven't explained how a character can travel that fast without reflexes/reactions to keep up with themselves. In this case, how Buffy could have traveled from Tibet to Budapest, England and Brussels and back after checking Gile's safe-houses in a couple of seconds without having the reactions/reflexes to keep up with herself. If you don't have an explanation for that then Buffy should also be able to fight at those speeds.
These were examples. Cannonball has high travel speed and almost no reaction speed. DBZ characters, like Goku, have high combat reaction times, but have far slower Travel Speeds in comparison. Another example is Vampire Hunter D. He has upwards of around Lightspeed to low FTL reaction at best. His Running/Travel speed isn't anything remotely in the same category.
Buffy is not Cannonball, and you haven't provided anything that proves that Cannonball can't do the same. You're just relying on an association fallacy right now.
As for the D thing. You have got what I was saying completely backwards. I was saying that a character with impressive movement speed should have reactions/reflexes to match, otherwise they wouldn't be able to keep up with themselves. Not that a character should have a movement speed that matches their reactions/reflexes.
The best Reaction you showed for Buffy was outpacing and reading the writing on a bullet. That's low super-sonic. Ichigo was demonstrating hypersonic combat reaction in Soul Society Arc as Bankai.
How could Buffy have checked/searched Gile's safe-houses in all those places, and come back in a couple of seconds, if she didn't have the reflexes/reactions to keep up with herself? There is no way she could have done that if she didn't have the reactions/reflexes to match.
Vegeta begs to differ. 2:06sec start.
Why would you even post a video of DBZ abridged to prove your point, which is wrong by the way, in a thread about Buffy VS Ichigo? That is completely unrelated.
Would that not be true? Oh and that's BS. They don't warp reality. Shifting dimensions isn't the same as warping reality.
Yeah, they do. The Anti-Spirals warp space and time, created a pocket universe, tossed Team Gurren into the multiverse labyrinth--which they all escaped--and spiral energy basically allows your beliefs to become reality. That's warping reality. Also, part of the plot of Tengen Toppa Gurren Lagann was that the spiral energy of spiral beings (humans, for instance) would grow endlessly until it would lead to spiral nemesis and destroy the universe.
Scale was kind of wonky in that fight. That's to be expected considering that both TTGL and the Anti-Spiral are reality warpers. It also makes it hard to tell how far the Earth was from them there, especially since they were in a different dimension at the time. As for the Anti-Spiral planet, we don't know how large it was or if it grew alongside Grand Zamboa.
Not sure but wasn't there also a databook that stated TTGL's size was around ten million light-years?
Galaxies in that fight against the Anti Spiral acted nothing like galaxies and were about as large as the Earth was.
Not from what I saw. I do remember the Anti-Spiral opening up a portal to view the Earth but I don't recall it being directly next to the galaxies to scale for size.
Plus, Super Galaxy Gurren Lagann was already dwarfing planets, and they were smaller in size by comparison to it when the Anti-Spiral ships started throwing them at SGGL if I remember correctly. TTGL is much larger than SGGL.
Spiderman is strong and fast (around supersonic), he also has precognition with his spider-sense, but he's outmatched here physically.
If Spidey can web up Luffy he can incapacitate him (that webbing can hold guys like the Thing and Iron Man down). The problem is Luffy is stronger, has his own precognition with his Haki (post time-skip), can tank any of Spidey's punches/kicks, and is faster by a good margin.
So, Luffy likely wins in both scenarios.
Cannonball can shoot through the air at super-fast speed. His reaction sucks. So, enough of your lame bs.
We're not even talking about Cannonball here.
You mean aside from the entire series making that blatantly evident? It was like that Ever. Goddamn. Time. Heck early in the Angel series, he was making deals with the people controlling the fates. That was the entire spiel. And you know that's what the characters themselves were saying, that it's all Destiny at work. Nothing about that actually said that Angel/Buffy was Responsible for those events.
So, you're going to excuse all the feats in the series as "lolDestiny." You're saying that the plot circumposes any of their abilities/feats?
Okay, if that's the case then I will ignore all the feats in Bleach because of "lolKubo." You're not making any sense here, and part of the plot of both Angel and Buffy was saying "screw you" to destiny. It didn't always work out but things did not go exactly according to fate every time.
Heck, even when Buffy was supposed to die at the master's hands she didn't stay dead. In turn, messing the whole system up in later seasons. Two Slayers, when there should have been one. Ring any bells?
Given their relative size in the imagery to that of the object they crashed though, it wasn't a mountain. It was a small plateu, and that's Angel + Buffy, not Buffy by herself. So you can't even attribute it to Buffy herself.
Buffy still had a part in its destruction and lets look at it again.
Does that look like a plateau in the second page? No.
That was definitely a mountain. Also, destiny had bollocks to do with the natural disasters they caused. It was all them and you're obfuscating the truth.
As for Hollow Ichigo, you haven't showed me anything that compares to that.
And yet the exact opposite is true in DBZ. Try again.
What are you on about?
Firstly, Buffy/Angel sex did not cause disruptions around the world. That, like most of the insanity in the Whedon-verse, is caused by the higher ups; deities and whatnot. "Destiny sex" was putting it mildly.
Do you have anything that actually supports that? Actual evidence?
Nonetheless, they still destroyed mountains whilst having sex and crashing into them so their durability/destructive ability should be around that level.
As for outrunning a bullet, not that impressive. That's low-supersonic.
Buffy has better feats.
Buffy flew from Tibet to at least Budapest, England and Brussels before two people right next to her noticed she was gone and then came back before Dawn could finish two words. This is at least 11,000 km covered in a couple of seconds.
Using Dawn's incomplete sentence as the time-frame and it would be around a second or two.
11,000 km/s is Mach 32,039.4, that's what it was if it was 1 second.
5,500 km/s is Mach 16,019.7, that's what it was if it was 2 seconds.
3666.6 km/s is Mach 10,679.8, that's what it was if it was 3 seconds.
That is hilariously faster than anything in Bleach.
In terms of travel speed, Buffy takes that since Bleach was never about travel anyway. As far as Combat speed goes though, Ichigo outclasses her completely.
No. I heard enough of that nonsense on the internet.
A character that travels that fast must have the reflexes/reactions necessary to keep up with themselves to effectively travel to where they want to. Otherwise they would have little-to-no control of their movement. There are instances where a character has superior arm movement/attack speed when compared to their movement speed (Cars from JJBA for instance) but a movement speed feat should also correlate towards a character's combat speed.
Text walls. Well, that's predicable.
TTGL still absorbed that energy and utilized it after Lord Genome gave the energy to it. It was able to endure the big bang attack until Genome appeared and absorbed it--it wasn't able to instantly destroy it, so its durability is still pretty insane. I also haven't made any arguments about speed yet, and you're just pulling stuff out of nowhere.
There are things that contradict Chakravartin's size. The fact that he consistently appears to be similar in size to the stars he uses in battle (and the one that he's floating above), and just because a planet is bigger than Destructor Asura--and he punched through it--does not mean he can do the same with TTGL. I mean that's just silly. That's like saying because Luke Cage could throw a tank, he could throw an entire mountain. The infinite power claim is pure speculation and you haven't backed it up with evidence or even any statements. Whilst, the big bang storm was said to have power capable of creating universes.
And also, that "metaphorical representation of power" applies to TTGL as well. Which only further evidences them in a sort of hyper-dimension, because otherwise no one would see them.
Except there's nothing contradicting it (that I'm aware of). The galaxy size seems pretty consistent in that fight. Your "hyper-dimension is smaller or metaphysical theory" is also pure speculation with nothing to back it up. Has it been stated to be smaller or some such? No.
Chakravartin has miniature galaxies floating around him, and was creating moons, planets and stars of various sizes and throwing them at Asura. Again, the thing with TTGL was the dimensional space they inhabited. You're never going to prove or disprove otherwise.
Those "galaxies" were smaller than Chakra was, whilst Chakra is comparable in size to a large star. Since in the fight with Destructor Asura he was a couple times larger than the star he was floating over. Ala, this:
At 6:53 you can see Chakravartin floating over a star. He also creates and tosses stars at Asura in the fight. Some were comparable in size to him when he made them. So those were either star-sized/planet-sized "galaxies," a metaphorical representation of his power, or something else.
Regardless, as I've said, the fighters are Scaled so they are of equal size, which negates the continuous absurd debate about sizing issues. So leave that shit at the door and move one. And let me make another point;
So, if you're not weakening TTGL as well it still wins because it could tank an attack that was compared to the big bang and absorb its power.
It really sounds like you're just trying to downplay TTGL here.
As far I recall, Asura is a star-buster. That's powerful and all but no where near powerful enough to beat TTGL.
Scaling can also mean bringing TTGL down to Asura's size (ie Planetary), which is prolly how big TTGL should've been anyway outside that whole distorted space dimension
It was the size of a galaxy.
You see that thing they were fighting on, and those two big disks the Anti-Spiral grabbed for his Big Bang Attack?
Yeah, those were galaxies. Super Galaxy Gurren Lagann also dwarfs planets as well and it's much weaker than TTGL.
Didn't Asura defeat the God of his universe? I don't think the scary robot is going to win here. Then again, I could be wrong.
The only thing Chakravartin made was the planet Asura lived on. Well, he claims to have made it. He also created Naraka, which is the afterlife of Asura's world. He's powerful enough to toss around planets and stars (I believe he was also able to make one star go nova, in their fight) but he should also be defeated by TTGL.
I don't recall Sun Wu Kong having any quantifiable feats that put him up to the Hulk's level, and even if this was a weaker version of the Hulk--let's say Grey Hulk--he's still a planet buster.
Grey Hulk destroying an asteroid twice the size of Earth (technically it should be a planetoid at that point but I'll just excuse that as "lolMarvel" nonsense) with the help of a rocket propulsion device.
Lord Barragam is a non-factor here and gets fodderized.