One Piece Episode Leaked a Day Early (Update)

Topic started by GodLen on May 30, 2009. Last post by Netstryke 5 years, 2 months ago.
Post by Kuro (559 posts) See mini bio Level 5
This is really, really shitty.
Post by paploo (48 posts) See mini bio Level 2
Given they included Funi's name in the torrent file, despite the file being random numbes on funi's site, it does make it seem pretty malicious on their part. Beyond ruining One Piece for anime fans, it'll probably also have future repercussions on other Toei anime, and on the choices others in the industry make. It probably took a lot of work [and it just occured to me that Toei might of even had to okay Funi's process] on Funi's part, and it's sad to see what much of fandom's reaction is to it [ie- directing their anger to Funi].
Post by Axersia (228 posts) See mini bio Level 11
@paploo: Ah, the filename actually consisted of random numbers? Well, in that case I take back what I said in my previous post.

That does make it seem more likely that the leak was malicious in nature.
Post by kiroshimatsu (94 posts) See mini bio Level 1
Jeebus... why can't people wait patiently?
Post by HSaabedra (136 posts) See mini bio Level 4
@lanaswift:

I wasn't referring to Funimation's business schedule, what I'm referring to is the fact that this situation is being turned into a one-sided attack when both parties are at equal fault.
Post by Niko (865 posts) See mini bio Level 8
It definitely looks like the "this is why we can't have nice things" has been summed up quite well in this case. This simultaneous release is what original fansubbers wanted. The whole point of fansubbing was that fans wanted to show a work to other fans that they otherwise wouldn't be able to see soon, if not ever. Now though, it seems like people are just wanting to get internet cred by having the latest thing as soon as possible, before anyone else. It's the same thing with movie spoilers running rampant across the internet. Patience and fandom are surplanted by the quest to seem cool on the internet, which is a fairly empty goal in and of itself.

People like this take the fan out of fansubs, figuratively and in this case literally since FUNi did all the work.
Post by GodLen (877 posts) See mini bio Level 10
Staff
@HSaabedra: I don't see how its FUNimation's fault, even if they left their front door open. I'm sure you wouldn't want that happening to you, right?
Post by lanaswift (636 posts) See mini bio Level 4
@HSaabedra: You really think that a mistake on FUNi's part-- and it sounds more and more like it was less of a problem with their security so much as a truly obsessive user --is really "equal" to what also sounds more and more like a malicious user trying to intentionally cause trouble? In what universe, exactly?
Post by HSaabedra (136 posts) See mini bio Level 4
@GodLen: Please avoid deflecting it into a personal issue as it has nothing to do with the discussion. Funimation knows how far fans will go to discover any and all new information if last December's license announcements were any indication.  For Funimation to believe that people wouldn't try and get at the episode before it was meant to go live is very naive and shortsighted, especially when their upload policies are common knowledge across the fanbase.

There was absolutely no need to upload the episode 24 hours ahead of time, combine that with the episode being placed on a public server and it was only a matter of time before this would happen.  There's no one to blame but Funimation themselves for letting it get to this point, and no amount of PR spin will fix the underlying IT policy issues.

lanaswift said:
@HSaabedra: You really think that a mistake on FUNi's part-- and it sounds more and more like it was less ... [more]

Without Funi as the vector, there would be no leak to begin with.  They're trying to turn the attention away from their own failure to protect Toei's property by pointing the finger at an easy target in order to regroup and deal with the aftermath.  Trying to spin this into anything but that is defending incompetence.

I should add that when I covered this on my blog late Friday night, the link in question was live all the way up until early Saturday morning.  It just so happens that someone with a disdain for the industry is the one getting the most attention now, instead of the blame being placed on the company that was supposed to protect its own interests.

The only fault I can find with the fansub group in question is the fact that they didn't post the original link in order to really make an example of Funimation, instead of doing what they did that has everyone in such a state of WHARRRRGARBL instead of thinking straight.
Post by lanaswift (636 posts) See mini bio Level 4
@HSaabedra: As Paploo pointed out, the filename was a random series of numbers. Whoever found it presumably had to go through every single large file to find it, and considering how many of these types of files there are on FUNi's video site, that's no small effort. Again, was it not as secure as it should be? Sure. Does that make the culpability of some asshole spreading it around any less? Of course not. That person chose to do something, either because they were too stupid to consider the consequences, or because they wanted to ruin things for people. Either way, they bear considerably more responsibility than than FUNi does with their underestimation. Arguing that "if they hadn't, someone else would have!" doesn't make that individual any less culpable either.

Also, work schedules DO make a difference. There WAS a 'need' to upload the episode early, because NO ONE WOULD BE THERE SATURDAY TO POST IT at the very instant they wanted it to go up, and they misjudged the safety of leaving it online overnight-- it's not like this has happened with FMA or Phantom, which they've probably done the same thing for, too. As for PR fixing IT policy issues, well, I'm pretty sure FUNi won't let this happen again. Assuming the Japanese companies even let them (or anyone) give it a shot.

I don't know if you're trying to defend the perpetrator or villainize FUNimation, but either way, equating an error in judgment to a malicious attempt to ruin the simulcast's launch is a pretty laughable comparison. Claiming that "NO ONE is to blame but FUNimation" is mind-bogglingly stupid. 

At risk of (gasp!) "personalizing" matters, consider this: if I leave my laptop out on a table and turn around, and someone takes it-- did I do something stupid? Yes. Does the thief suddenly no longer bear any responsibility? Can that thief be found "not guilty by reason of the victim being dumb"? Of course not.
Post by HSaabedra (136 posts) See mini bio Level 4
@lanaswift:

I recently edited my prior post so it would be best to read it.

As far as your other points, there's no need to go "into the office" to setup a  new stream, as it can be handled remotely while still remaining secure with no danger of leaks as anyone with a knowledge of server management will attest to.  As far as your inability to see my position, its pretty simple.  Both are at fault for different reasons, yet everyone chooses to ignore one side in order to fit their perception of the facts.

I really would appreciate it if people would cut it out with using personal analogies, as they make no sense in this context.  Last I read this was about a company leaking an episode prior to its intended airdate, not some internet group angling for fame.
Post by lanaswift (636 posts) See mini bio Level 4
@HSaabedra: The more things you handle remotely, the harder it is to keep them-- ahem --secure. Funny how that works.

I don't think anyone, much less myself, is arguing that FUNi's system was perfect-- the proof is in the pudding there. And I don't think anyone (worth listening to) thinks that the torrenter(s) didn't do anything wrong either. So...I don't see why you say "everyone" is choosing to ignore one side or the other.

Our disagreement is on how much blame to lay on which side. And yes, I will always place more blame on the people who actually did something malicious for the sake of causing trouble than on the the people who tried to do something awesome and did not do so 100% perfectly 100% of the time (again, remember-- FUNi has been simulcasting two other shows, one a particularly big-name show, and has not had this problem previously; it airs on a real weekday, but I'd be surprised if prior to this it wasn't getting set up early as well).

As for my laptop thief analogy being "inappropriate," would you prefer it if I said a "company" left a laptop on a table and a thief snatched it up? The thief is still culpable even if the victim isn't an individual. What if a "company" were to upload a document of business plans, unlinked anywhere else on the Internet, only intended for use by company employees-- and someone outside the company sat at a computer and typed in every word they could think of with every common filetype they could think of hoping to find that file, and by luck and lots of spare time managed to find it and publicize it? Does that outsider *really* only bear the most minimal of responsibilities, and the company deserves whatever it gets for daring not to realize that someone would waste so much time doing that? Get real.

"She was asking for it because she was dressed like a slut" isn't an excuse for rape, and "they were asking for it because the file was there and findable by an obsessive moron willing to spend hours looking so they could torrent it" isn't an excuse either. (Oh NOES! More actual PEOPLE in analogies! Protip: actual people work at FUNimation and Toei; an actual person creates One Piece, and this kind of thing can affect those PEOPLE directly. So quit giving shit for personal analogies. Just because they involve human beings doesn't make them magically inaccurate.)

And if you read that FUNimation "leaked" the episode, I would have to question the accuracy and/or wording of whoever wrote what you read. FUNimation didn't "leak" anything, they misjudged the security of their system. In this context I think it's fair to say that "leak" implies some intent, which we most certainly can lay entirely on the shoulders of the torrenter(s). Unless you'd like to argue that FUNimation WANTED people to torrent their awesome simulcast early. 

I suppose you could argue that there is no such thing as "context," and that therefore a "leak" of a video is no different from a "leak" in a pipe, that intent therefore doesn't matter because a dictionary said so, and that FUNimation is therefore the "leak." But surely you're not out of real ideas so soon that you'd devolve into merely being pedantic. Right?

So, to summarize: as I've said several times, FUNi's system obviously needs improvements and I am not arguing that point. That does NOT! I repeat, does NOT! lessen the culpability of the person or persons who are responsible for the video showing up on BitTorrent. In any way, shape, or form. Assholes are assholes, whether it's made easier for them or not.
Post by lolwut (30 posts) See mini bio Level 5
Hi Funi, welcome to the internet, where things from time to time get leaked early. You have to admit that you fucked up, fix it and move on. Look at Wolverine. After that was leaked did the studio decide to not release it in theaters? No, they complained and released it anyway, to good ticket sales and alright reviews. Funi needs to fix whatever issue they had and hope that it doesn't happen again.

So to my next point. I am truly and utterly confused. What exactly do you all have against fansubs? I can see in this particular case a fansub group robbed you of your source of low quality releases, but why all the hate for fansubbers in general?


Also, @paploo. Please keep your ranting on ANN. There I can laugh at everyone but here... I actually like it here. Its is the one anime news source I can actually stand, and I don't want to see the community reach the horrid depths that ANN's reaches on a daily basis.
Post by HSaabedra (136 posts) See mini bio Level 4
lanaswift said:
@HSaabedra: The more things you handle remotely, the harder it is to keep them-- ahem --secure. Funny how that works.I ... [more]
Post by GodLen (877 posts) See mini bio Level 10
Staff
@HSaabedra:  What I am trying to say is that there is no way in hell you can blame the victim.  That argument would never fly in court.
Post by Zeouterlimits (516 posts) See mini bio Level 7
Frankly, this just a depressing blow for the industry.
   It really is "why we can't have nice things".
Funimation is in trouble now because they were trying to have something to help the Western audience and left a stupid gap.
Then someone worse came along and exploited that. And spread the results of the exploit.
    It's a poor showing by all.

Oh well, our drills spin on...
Post by Dream (7,418 posts) See mini bio Level 20
Moderator
Just to give a quick update to this issue, it looks like Funi pulled all the episodes of FMA: Brotherhood off their video site. Nothing's listed when you go through the info link for the series. By the looks of it, Phantom episodes are still up on the site though.
Post by lanaswift (636 posts) See mini bio Level 4
@lolwut: It's not (necessarily) fansubs-- it's people who download fansubs, like shows enough to watch them all the way through, and then refuse to ever actually buy said series because they've already seen them. I admit, I don't buy every single thing I watch an episode or two of fansubbed, but if I get through the whole damn series you bet your ass I'll spend money on it when the legit version comes out, because I want [insert localizer here] to be able to continue releasing good stuff in the US, and I want [insert creator and Japanese production companies here] to continue making it. And yes, overseas funds do count.

It used to be that fansubbers as a whole respected licenses and wanted anime to do well here, so they'd quit subbing something when it was licensed. And some fansubbers still do, of course...but by and large it seems to have developed into an attitude of "fuck the localizers and stuff, we just want to get the episode up and get a fanbase of our own!" or something.
Post by HSaabedra (136 posts) See mini bio Level 4
@GodLen:
Funimation was never a "victim".  They KNEW about the stream rippers and fansubbers using their episodes long before this situation transpired.
They had months to fix these glaring issues and did nothing, choosing to willfully ignore torrent sites and tacitly approve the ripping practice .
Post by Netstryke (71 posts) See mini bio Level 8
So the question is do we blame everybody and blame nobody? What matters is that it happened and the punishment was swift and just and the ripples are now being felt throughout FUNI and North American Fandom. All because One person could not wait and they had the stupid need for bragging rights.

Hope they're proud, they just screwed everyone and I bet they sitting at their computer and laughing their ass off.
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