What the F@#$ Did I Just Watch?! EVANGELION Episodes 11 + 6

Topic started by Tom_Pinchuk on April 25, 2010. Last post by hitsusatsu11 2 years ago.
Post by Tom_Pinchuk (729 posts) See mini bio Level 11
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One thing I’ve found amusing while watching this series has been the recurring issues of size and scale. The Evas are supposed to collosusi, so he distance an Eva would need to snipe an angel (as Shinji did in an earlier episode) would be ABSURD. And, here, the crawl space an Eva would be able to sneak through would have to be ENORMOUS. I’m sure it fits into how absurdly enormous NERV’s facility must be, but still… I couldn’t but smirking over the fact that there were air ducts these giant robots could crawl through.

The scene in question where the three pilots are crawl out to sneak under the angel has to be one of my favorite scenes of the series, so far. I think it was the right mix of characterization and internal logic for me - - that is, the whole on-the-field plan made with Asuka taking the acid while Rei fetches the rifles for Shinji to then fire. I couldn’t have predicted it, and it made a lot of sense, making me feel almost like an active participant in the story - - making this (as so often say) feel very visceral. It actually reminded me of an obscure video game from the 90s called LOST VIKINGS. The whole gimmick was that you controlled these three Vikings through various environmental puzzles. One had a shield, the other had a bow and arrow and the last one could just run and jump. The whole solution to the acid spitting spider angel seemed like it’d fit right in to the gameplay.

Shinji finally asks the big question that’s taken 10 episodes to get to. Just why are these “angels” evil giant monsters. I realize that’s a thread that’s been intentionally left loose and, judging by the Kabalah-esque symbols in the intro, I’m sure the answer’s going to run a lot deeper than what’s apparent on the surface.

Also, I was going back through the log of these and realized that I never actually posted my thoughts on Episode #6. Mea culpa. Mea maxima culpa. I think I can got so swept in enjoying this show and watching episode after episode in quick succession, that I actually jumped ahead. So, for anybody who feels like they missed out… here’s what I thought. Coincidentally, it’s actually the episode with the giant-sized sniper range.

What the F@#$ Did I Just Watch?! EVANGELION Episode #6

Numbers and calculations have never been my strong suit, but I can’t help thinking about the figures implied by the climax of this episode. You’ve already got skyscraper-sized  Eva suits, right? Then you’ve Shinji using a colossal sniper rifle that’s longer than his Eva is tall, right? And then he has to lay down at adequately-far distance from the angel he’s fighting here. I mean, that distance must at least be a hundred miles for him to be out of the angel’s field of vision. That is FAR. I’d figure the Earth would start noticeably curving over that distance. I suppose it’s a little ludicrous but, then again, I also suppose that’s the name of the game, here.

Distance quibbles aside, I’m honestly getting wrapped up in the story here. I can believe Shinji and Rei’s relationship, the team work they have to pull off to take out the monster and the panic Shinji experiences when he thinks Rei’s been injured. Given everything I’ve heard about the psychology underlying this story, I can’t help thinking that there’s something Fruedian being conveyed about their relationship.  Shinji’s jealous that his father’s giving her the affection he holds off from him, yet he’s also holding back a pretty strong crush on her.  Also, in this episode, Rei confuses Shinji with his father for a moment when he opens her escape pod.  It doesn’t exactly correspond to the Oedipal archetype, but there’s definitely some odd identification issues going on, here. I’m sure they’re going to be explored in more detail throughout the series.

Actually, I also couldn’t help wondering about what the state of the world is after the whole incident with Nerv using all of Japan’s power to charge that sniper rifle. They sort of touch upon the backstory of the world being flooded, but I’m a little confused about exactly how declined the global society is supposed to be in here. Sometimes, Tokyo-3 seems like it’s a totally abandoned. Other times, it seems like life’s just going on like normal. Is it all simply a matter of the periodic evacuations into the subterranean shelters? Clarify for me, here.

-- Tom Pinchuk is the writer of UNIMAGINABLE for Arcana Comics and HYBRID BASTARDS! for Archaia. Pre-order the HYBRID BASTARDS! hardcover now on Amazon.com.

Post by hitsusatsu11 (9,387 posts) See mini bio Level 20
For Episode 11: Good episode, get to see all three pilots working together and interacting. You can really start to see that Asuka is threatened by Rei's quiet nature, and so she seems to try overly hard to compensate, especially in regards to both female pilots relationship with shinji. The way Asuka plays defense and takes the acid is again a way for Asuka to reassure herself and feel superior, she cannot allow herself to be indebted to shinji for helping her in the volcano incident. 
 
For Episode 6: This episode is quite possibly the height of shinji and Rei's pre-asuka relationship, there working together is the culmination of there interaction so far (this showing the fruits of such interactions as the apartment incident, and the subsequent discussion and slap when talking of Gendo) When shinji pulls Rei out of the Eva, and she remembers Gendo doing the same in an earlier test gone wrong, it really begins to show her human side. When shinji is speaking to her and she says she doesn't know what to do at times like this, and shinji tells her to smile it tells us her 'human-less ness' is not something of her choice and is in fact very lonely.
 
@Tom_Pinchuk:
Yes the Evas are about 40m tall I believe so Tokyo-3 must be very very big to accommodate all the room for the evas underground. About your earlier question of how society reacts to Nerv using all of japans power, Nerv is run by the UN and is thus exempt from Japan's rulings, needless to say Japan does not like this and is very interested in what goes on there and it  seeks to find out (i don't want to spoil anything if it hasn't been revealed yet) but this somehow involves misato's boyfriend Kaji.
 
About the curvature of the earth, they corrected i believe for gravity or magnetic field or something, so likely they corrected for that to, somehow XD.
 
EDIT: Yes there is much more Freudian themes to come, with Rei and shinji, and also in other more unexpected places.
Post by OmegaChosen (43 posts) See mini bio Level 6
Interesting reactions to the episodes. More or less along the lines expected anyway. Regarding the ducts they can crawl through, NERV seems to have made a maze of Evangelion lifts so that where ever an Angel attacks Tokyo-3, they can "shoot" the Eva up as near as possible. I'm pretty sure there's gotta be ducts constructed in that maze in case a lift malfunctions and the Eva needs to get out of that place pronto. And yes, NERV is not only big but DEEP underground, seeing as you gotta be shot out of the ground via lift, while inside an Eva no less.
 
In any case, not much to be said this week either. Everything is going pretty well in-universe at this point.
 
Next Episode:  "She said, 'Don't make others suffer for your personal hatred.'"
Post by ReVolutionOfEvangelion (102 posts) See mini bio Level 3
1 - Evas are officially "40 meters tall" - big enough that a person is about as tall as the palm of their hand - but this fluctuates wildly given artistic license, much like King Kong or Godzilla:  the Eva-verse does strive to be realistic, but at the end of the day this is "Giant Robot" not "Real Robot" - its realistic more in terms of "internal plot consistency" than "this is real-world science, you can measure its specifications like an F-18".  Don't worry so much about it.
 
2 - Rei, Shinji, Gendo, and the Oedipal Complex.  You have no idea....
 
3 - the state of Japan is that it is indeed "recovered", but the global socio-political situation is only mentioned in brief hints scattered through several episodes, and some of it is only mentioned in the supplementary materials;  our fansite made a 30 minute long "fan-made DVD documentary feature" (part of a series of these) called "Evangelion's Post-Second Impact World" - if you're curious about this, you should watch it:  
http://revolutionofevangelion.org/evangelions-post-second-impact-world/ 
 
The reason you don't see "people" around Tokyo-3 that much is because of budget problems, but also because its sort of a plot point that these characters rarely interact with other people; they're isolated and alone.  You *do* see 'people' walking around in episodes 6 and 11.  Its just that you see increasingly less of "everyday" folk because hey, Shinji doesn't interact with them.  The school characters are more or less the "man on the street" though.
 
4 -  The Kabbalah imagery is absolutely meaningless.  The Gainax creators have repeatedly said, "guys we threw that in to look cool" - the Angels are not of metaphysical/religious origin.  Its more like 2001: A Space Odyssey; they *are* aliens, but you'll see. 
 
Points to watch out for when looking for the real clues about where Angels come from:  in episode 12...they go to Antarctica, because Second Impact was there;  notice the mysterious object covered in wrappings, lashed to the aircraft carrier deck (visible for under a second)
 
A bit more about the origin of the Angels is explained in episode 21, but its very vague...I'll point it out when we get there (again, watch the director's cut episodes of 21-24)
 
 Still, one of the points of the show was *a satire of the Giant Robot genre*...and in Giant Robot, there's usually "giant space monsters" who you have to fight, like in Ultraman or Godzilla.  And its a point of satire that Shinji has to actually ask "uh...what are these things and why are we even fighting them?  I kind of just ASSUMED that 'Giant Robots fight monsters' but you never actually gave a reason...its almost as if the force of the plot dragged this forward"
 
Also, the Angels aren't the REAL bad guys...
Post by MetalGearFlaccid (24 posts) See mini bio Level 3
Dude. Just you wait until End of Eva. The scale will blow your mind.
 I know I keep mentioning this movie, but believe me, you are going to lose your shit. (In a good way or a bad way? Depends on the person you are, really.)
Post by constanzadellarosa (234 posts) See mini bio Level 15
Oh, Mr. Freud would rise from his grave to have a therapy session with those three...  and almost the entire cast.
 
Lack of people around? Later you'll know how many people died after the Second Impact and you will figure things out.
 

Post by Tom_Pinchuk (729 posts) See mini bio Level 11
Staff
@MetalGearFlaccid:  Could you guys build that up some more?
Post by OmegaChosen (43 posts) See mini bio Level 6
@Rev: You're kind of giving away a lot there, at least in my opinion. You don't need to mention something and then say you'll get back to it later, just don't mention it until said episode. I understand you're excited to tell him all about Evangelion but wait till the later episodes to get into the huge posts. He's only at episode 11 and not much will start to go on until at least episode 14 and even then just an inkling.  Also, seeing that you have a site explains a lot.
 
@Tom: In any case, I've started to watch the series again thanks to your posts. It's been a while since I've seen them last and it's always nice seeing the series again, especially when you know what's coming. >_>
Post by Tom_Pinchuk (729 posts) See mini bio Level 11
Staff
@OmegaChosen: That's great! Like I said, it's been a long time since I've enjoyed something as much as this. The only other long form anime shows I've watched are VISION OF ESCAFLOWNE (which was amazing) and RECORD OF LODOSS (which was so boring, I had to stop watching it).
Post by hitsusatsu11 (9,387 posts) See mini bio Level 20
@Tom_Pinchuk: I don't know if you mentioned it already and I forget, but are you watching the series dubbed or subbed?
 
Escaflowne is a sick show to btw
Post by Tom_Pinchuk (729 posts) See mini bio Level 11
Staff
@hitsusatsu11:  I'll confess... I'm watching it dubbed.
Post by hitsusatsu11 (9,387 posts) See mini bio Level 20
@Tom_Pinchuk: Nice, while the sub is great the Eva dub is excellently put together, i would say at least as good as the jap voice performances. The only problems I have with the dub are with some minor characters and voice changes for directors cut. (gendo, and especially "black" hyuga) 
Spike spencers shinji i believe is very good, probably better than his jap counter part (megumi ogata), I also prefer Tiffeny Grants english Asuka (though many disagree) Rei is well done in both ( in Japanese she's megumi hayashibara)  but i give the edge to Amanda Winn lee, who is also ADV's adr director for EVA. Misato is very good in both, with her jap seiryu being the famous Kotono Mitsuishi who played sailor moon, and her english actress being Allison Keith. 
Eva is for sure one of those anime's that are great subbed or dubbed, theres a rich history behind both language's voicing to the show (rumors anno had shinji's voice actress actually choke asuka's va while performing their famous scene in EoE in Japanese, allegations of Amanda Winn lee going "mad" with power in her sound edits for the english Death and Rebirth)
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