Should Power Levels be used for powerscailing?

Topic started by othus12 on Feb. 11, 2014. Last post by GrayWolf2 3 months ago.
Post by DeathHero61 (237 posts) See mini bio Level 8

@flashback180:

  • it doesn't matter the fact is they used flawed concepts . its no different from the 100's of goku calculations on the net. and HST..... and there are better ways of calculating his feats
  • Getting hit by a rock apart from being a glass canon its also thrown by krillen who isn't weak by any means. if using fillers are allowed how can the 40 ton argument be valid .

goku was lifting a tree bigger than his house in the first episode of z .

goku getting "hurt" was to show he's calm and relaxed like he said he would and that doesn't even make any sense , goku took freezs finger beam to his face .The same beam that killed vegeta

and put a hole in piccolo.

honestly that's just low balling him saying he gets hurt by rocks and needles.

  • striking attacks are ment to be that way they are not supposed to be AOE type of attacks . thats the first diffrence between comics and anime .They do just as much damage as normal ki blast freeza can withstand a planet bust in point blank with no ki.

yet he was dying under gokus combat moves .

I have said this before Cells self destruction was not "just" a planet buster , just because there was 1 planet there doesn't make it a planet buster. mins later he was regenerated to SPC and said he was going to bust the solar system..

Self destructing is/has and always will be depending on the intensity.SSJ2 vegetas self destruction blew up buu but did less damage than Nappa did to east city .

AOE =/= DC

Actually there are tons of calculations that are better than screw attacks . noone said it should be 100% accurate it should be enough to not contradict itself . these guys put them in a range DBZ has been before anyone used the internet for these kind of stuff .since then the blogs and theorys keep growing, lol you can take my word for this ,no one has enough time to read them all.

1. Then you really have no right to complain. Everyone makes their own speculations on the characters and the level of power they have. They skimmed through the series and gathered whatever feats they can find relevant enough to compare to superman. So nobody would think its biased. Otherwise like i said you would have been looking at an extremely weak goku.

2.Funny you should say that since the average tree is only 1000 to maybe 5000 pounds? Maybe 4 tons? At the very best that tree is maybe 8? ten tons?

3. He has gotten hurt by weaker attacks on many other occasions. His durability and strength are the most inconsistent. Thats why they made those formulas.

Wizard: So, Superman’s feats and skills are definitively measured. However, Goku’s are not and are difficult to judge.

And they were clearly working hard finding different theories to work with. This was the only one they can conclude really works.

4.At this point its not even lowballing because Akira is so poor at writing scenes because he is too lazy to show how much stronger goku gets.(I came to the conclusion that he is lazy because he said himself that when he is drawing the fight scenes he makes the characters take it to an abandoned field just so the scene can be easier to draw and take less time.) He would never tell us goku's limits even within the story. All of superman's writers show superman's limits are dependant on the sun. They showed CLEARLY how much he can take. They showed CLEARLY how much he can dish out. They showed CLEARLY what he can do. Now tell me did akira do this? Goku's strength? INCONSISTENT. Goku's speed INCONSISTENT. Goku's durability HYPED UP AND INCONSISTENT. Goku

P.S the finger beam killed vegeta because it pierced his heart.(or his lung like TFS said lol) And he was already on the VERGE OF DEATH.

5. Even DBZ has AOE with their strikes TBH. Look at majinn vegeta vs goku. People say that goku can destroy 10 planets with a punch. Thats great and all. But Lets think for a second. It doesn't and im serious it doesn't matter how durable you are there is no way you can absorb the full shockwave of a force of something that can destroy 10 planets. If punches equaled the force of Ki there would be no need to punch opponents. Or vice versa with Ki.

6.Hey maybe you don't remember. It was Semi-Perfect that was doing the kamikaze. Not super perfect cell. And that statement is useless. Not a single character in DBZ(not even broly to be honest.) has shown to solar system bust. Or claim to do so after cell(aside from bills who i will get to later.)

SSJ2 vegetas self destruction blew up buu but did less damage than Nappa did to east city

Doesn't matter. Just more bad writing and inconsistencies. Unless you are going to throw away the respect i had for you so far and say something such as DBZ characters can manipulate explosions so they don't destroy the planet which to be honest is complete utter BS.

those were just some random examples among many in the list on what could piss people off nothing in particular ,they could and should have presented it better , lol for example when you take ghandi or martin luther and make them look like raging thugs in a rap song people are going to say wtf is this.

there should have been a neutral line . the animation was a non factor the least they could have done was making it look convincing , idk how about a world tournament superman has been in tournaments before too so it would make sense.

so you expect people to just accept the feats given even though they can see through the mistakes at first glance, so basically if a guy comes up with a video of gokus durability being lesser than a rock based on some incident and formula ...people are supposed to accept it ._.

the difference between a normal dbz battle and screw attack is you don't find people making up formulas that map the strength for the character till the end of the series. if we go by your concept the video is just as accurate as every calculation of goku on the internet let it be a small rock buster - a multiversal buster, they all will be correct if thats the case.

once its proven wrong it loses its credibility , no one uses death battle calculations because of this. power scaling isn't about getting a number or formulas or anything its to get a approx of their capability .

people use power scaling cos its simple using this aprox feat the battle is progressed .

ex:

A= mountain level B= ? C= island level

if A >B>C

means B is somewhere between mountain and island level

It doesn't really matter because there is no way the people who were mad would have presented either supes or goku well. A majority of them would have had goku at solar system levels of striking strength, or universe busting ki manipulation or like that one bold guy on animevice who said goku can bust 75 billion galaxies with a punch. While these same goku fans would have probably showed off the animated television version of superman because they never read a comic in their life. The difference is, that ERB is purposely supposed to be funny. So when a video like theirs are made people should have the common sense to shut the heck up and except the video for what it is. Comedy. They should except what they saw in DB. An opinion based on facts, statements, and other forms of research and logical thinking. If Goku fanboys couldn't handle that, its their fault not wiz and boomstick's and their friends who helped in researching these characters.

If the animation was a non factor like they said on multiple occasions, then NOBODY should be complaining. The battle is a representation of the research gathered. If nobody can understand the rules they clearly show the viewers than its simple blind bias from fanboys. They couldn't comprehend simple restrictions and rules.

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/WebAnimation/DeathBattle?from=Main.DEATHBattle

if a guy comes up with a video of gokus durability being lesser than a rock based on some incident and formula ...people are supposed to accept it ._.

Okay now you are taking it completely out of context lol. That's not what i meant. So its only fair Goku is hyped up to levels that are not even true? If people only accepted that, it shows how shallow and petty they really are.

Actually your wrong. Powerscaling can be contradicted allot in DBZ. I will admit it can be used for other fiction but for DBZ especially its not appliciable because its taken out of proportion and its inconsistent. Dragon ball Z LOOKS weaker than HST but some fans try to scale the characters to cosmic level beings who destroy dimensions and universes.

Got me there but what i mean is that they shouldn't be complaining. Its like complaining about south park or boondocks when they "offend" the celebrities or the races in their shows. When they clearly show warnings that they would do it in the first place and if you don't like it get the F out. Lets get back to Death Battle. They clearly showed rules. Conditions. Based on research and evidence gathered and presented they will decide the winner. They aren't 100 percent experts. No one is. Thats why they debate and talk and argue about the research they gathered for hours and eventually come to the conclusion on who wins.

Pretty sure most DBZ calcs can be proven wrong. And im pretty sure nearly every DBZ calc is less credible than Death Battle. Actually it is. DBZ use powerlevels as well as the measurements Babidi was giving goku.

Powerscaling is simple but its not appliciable if there's so many inconsistencies like DBZ.

Powerscaling and ABC logic is more like this:

Here is a quote from one of my debates when i was representing teen goku on comicvine

The dragon ball universe requires scaling since the series isn't like the mainstream HST which clearly shows improvement in strength and power for the characters. So we use ABC logic and Power Scaling. If Bastard A who can move at base supersonic speeds get completely blitzed before he can even react by Bastard B he would be deemed as high supersonic or low hypersonic. If Bastard A can bench press 20 tons and Bastard B overpowered him that means that Bastard B can do a similar feat if not far better. Dragon ball feats unlike its successor DBZ are consistent enough to use such methods.

Moving on.

well i was talking about the time line canoonity .but anyway t the specials are canon (berdoc: father of goku and history of trunks is cannon)

Proof?

movies that fit in the time line

The Dead Zone - before radditz (only plot hole is krillen knows gohan)

revenge of Cooler- 3year gap before cell saga

return of Cooler- 3 year gap before cell saga

brollys second home coming - before the tournament

wrath of dragon- before EOS buu saga and BOG

BOG- 7 year gap with after buu saga

are among the list.TFS were mentioning the plot holes not the timeline vegeta had no way to get to namek

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This is a misunderstanding Instant transmission doesn't always need such concentration, he has used it regularly in battle. He just needs to know where the ki is finding the ki is the only problem .

he has gone to king kais planet in an instant

against cells kamhamha in battle (the same kamahaha that reached deep space before in moments)

against cell during battle

against super buu

against kid buu multiple times

against bills- in close combat

just because he failed ONCE because he was OUTRUNNING a PLANET BUSTING attack doesn't mean he cant use it in battle .

.

if it was not measurable to such extent it would be like time was frozen. gokus speed within IT >>>>>>>X SUPERMAN

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what... no flash is way faster than superman he can beat instantaneous movement from point to point that's grater than mod sups has ever shown.

most feats in dbz are inconsistent , DBZ is filled with it.You have pointed it on your previous posts yoursself .

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i don't see how its different from sups sun dip giving a guy with supposed unmeasurable energy

1. These movies don't fit in the timeline at all. For example. Broly's second home coming was before the tournament during the buu saga. How would that make sense? If broly was the current threat at that time, piccolo, and literally all the z fighters should have been there helping gohan. Goku would have wasted his one day to support gohan. Plot holes or timelines it doesn't matter if these movies has plot holes to such extents then it wouldn't fit the timeline. If in the cooler movie goku fought with the IT then shouldn't he have no real problems using IT to speed blitz Cell? or Buu? or virtually everyone he fought after learning the technique? No it doesn't fit. Don't get me started on Wrath of dragon.

BOG is canon so there is really nothing to say there.

2. Actually it does. It usually takes him a few seconds to concentrate on where he is going with the instant transmission.

3. Of course, its a small planet thats not that far plus he has been there on several occasions,

4. Can you show me this?

5.Yeah it took forever for him to actually teleport in cell's face. The z fighters were all having a conversation while cell even formed a long sentence himself while goku was getting ready.

6. To be honest its been awhile since i saw that fight, may i see that please?

7.Same as above

8. Um he was simply doing it multiple times to confuse bills. Nothing like against cooler where IT is somehow all of a sudden his combat speed.

That one time is a good example that he needs to concentrate in order to use it.

9. Not when superman can simply speed up his senses to match flash's top speed.

10.Actually the sun is different. The sun itself is an immeasurable source. Superman's connection to the sun is a staple to superman's identity. Its part of the kryptonian anatomy. IT is some random technique we know nothing about. All we know is that goku learned it from strangers. For some reason didn't teleport back to earth to stop frieza from coming, and has used it in combat.

And BTW you know something that i think nobody not even deathbattle or the people against them noticed?

Goku lifted 40 tons on kai's planet right? Well the planet has ten times earth's gravity. Which would equal that 40 tons to a whopping 400 tons. Goku later trained in 100 times earth's gravity. thats a good 4000 tons in base form. I wish someone noticed that sooner. Not that it makes a difference in goku's and supes fight in any way. But its a good thing to take into consideration.

1.lol yes it would a ssj4 with kaio kan would be epic , and ssj4 can handle the strain .They can amp SSJ4 with power from the sprit bomb but they can't, amp they body with kaiokan!

2.nope, goku did it too. right after he escaped from the hospital without telling anyone , he tosses a giant pyramid in the sky and hits it head on . ends up in worse shape than he was in, chichi and roshi later finds him fallen on the ground.i think it's during the filler episode where bulma,gohan & krillen visits the fake namek.

piccolo too did this much earlier .

5.it was shown exactly like that kabuto kai ..was worried that their planet was being destroyed.

6.that doen't mean they cant survive for a while, most movie versions can fight in space

kid goku,fillers(vegeta),burdoc,movie 2 & 14 proves this

there is more proof that supports this statement than anything against it

7.yes it would have.people generally say ki attack cant reach superman this is solid valid point.

8.neither did the sprite bomb and goku goes berserk with power, he killed him.

9.^

10.they showed GT version which is exactly like the movie version.the only difference is in the movie wrath of the dragon, gokus was nowhere never Hirudegarn even mystic gohan wasn't putting scratch .

it the the strongest villein before bog , taking away the strongest attack in DBZ isn't exacly fair

they used sun dip an you put a number to that.-_-

11.they cooked made up formula from the closet to get some number as proof, they could have done the same in bog.

lol XD ok.. berus isn't a solar system buster even though he has been stated to be one, even tho ssj1 in the anime can bust 10 planet , even though kid buu bust the earth with a attack that would bust a planet 10 times bigger and would have destroyed the solar system in less than 1 hour(yes in the anime)

the same berus who beat ssj3 with a flick and beat mystic gohan with a punch ..

Whiss said he did it before , thats just as creditable as freeza destroying planet vegata statement.

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can you prove he isn't a solar system buster, he is commonly accepted as a casual ss buster by now.

1.Kaioken was specifically stated to be a dangerous technique that puts a strain on the body. Spirit bomb on the other hand is completely different.

2. I been looking around and i did not find said occurrence. Can you post it?

5.Just because they were worried about their planet's destruction doesn't mean they were traversing the entire planet.

6.Are you sure they were not on the edge of the atmosphere or something or holding their breath because if they were talking then that means they must have grew some form of space gills when i turned around to grab popcorn. Were they legit in space like completely outside the earth's orbit and what not?

The Human body has enormous difficulty adjusting above ~21000 ft. For reference, Mount Everest is 29000 ft tall, meaning that climbers must take oxygen tanks for the last part of the ascent. The reason for this is not a lack of oxygen in the atmosphere as a whole, but a lack of oxygen in each breath that results from the molecules being very spread out at high altitudes.

Kid goku when he did it was a gag feat. Honestly the science i have behind goku not being capable of breathing in space is because when he was brought up as a child on earth, his body adapted to needing air to survive. It either that or more bad writing from akira.

7. It wouldn't. People constantly argue the real speed of ki blasts in the first place.

8. What?

9. What?

10. How is GT exactly like the movie version? The fact that its non-canon?

The "strongest attack" you mean the dragon fist? They had that. And the Kamehameha has always been the strongest attack in dragon ball z realistically.

11.No comment.

Please give me prove that bills can destroy solar systems. I watched the movie. He can't do that.

Post by flashback180 (870 posts) See mini bio Level 14

lol our threads are getting too long to take the time to explain it all ..even my browser cant handle it :)

@DeathHero61 said:

1. Then you really have no right to complain. Everyone makes their own speculations on the characters and the level of power they have. They skimmed through the series and gathered whatever feats they can find relevant enough to compare to superman. So nobody would think its biased. Otherwise like i said you would have been looking at an extremely weak goku.

2.Funny you should say that since the average tree is only 1000 to maybe 5000 pounds? Maybe 4 tons? At the very best that tree is maybe 8? ten tons?

3. He has gotten hurt by weaker attacks on many other occasions. His durability and strength are the most inconsistent. Thats why they made those formulas.

Wizard: So, Superman’s feats and skills are definitively measured. However, Goku’s are not and are difficult to judge.

And they were clearly working hard finding different theories to work with. This was the only one they can conclude really works.

4.At this point its not even lowballing because Akira is so poor at writing scenes because he is too lazy to show how much stronger goku gets.(I came to the conclusion that he is lazy because he said himself that when he is drawing the fight scenes he makes the characters take it to an abandoned field just so the scene can be easier to draw and take less time.) He would never tell us goku's limits even within the story. All of superman's writers show superman's limits are dependant on the sun. They showed CLEARLY how much he can take. They showed CLEARLY how much he can dish out. They showed CLEARLY what he can do. Now tell me did akira do this? Goku's strength? INCONSISTENT. Goku's speed INCONSISTENT. Goku's durability HYPED UP AND INCONSISTENT. Goku

P.S the finger beam killed vegeta because it pierced his heart.(or his lung like TFS said lol) And he was already on the VERGE OF DEATH.

5. Even DBZ has AOE with their strikes TBH. Look at majinn vegeta vs goku. People say that goku can destroy 10 planets with a punch. Thats great and all. But Lets think for a second. It doesn't and im serious it doesn't matter how durable you are there is no way you can absorb the full shockwave of a force of something that can destroy 10 planets. If punches equaled the force of Ki there would be no need to punch opponents. Or vice versa with Ki.

6.Hey maybe you don't remember. It was Semi-Perfect that was doing the kamikaze. Not super perfect cell. And that statement is useless. Not a single character in DBZ(not even broly to be honest.) has shown to solar system bust. Or claim to do so after cell(aside from bills who i will get to later.)

1.so you agree?...thier calculation is just as valid as every random calculation on the net.

2. ...1000 pounds na that tree is too big to be in 1000's, based on its size it should be around 18-20 tons.the least,

i know this cos years ago a average sized tree was chopped down from my parents garden and it was over 1000 kgs in total . that tree is nowhere near the sheer size of this one.

or you could calculate with this site ,

http://www.woodweb.com/cgi-bin/calculators/calc.pl?calculator=log_weight

goku is ft 5'9 , the length of the tree is at least 20 feet , seeing its width is bigger than gokus height(on pannel) its diameter would be grater than 5'9.

you underestimate the weight of trees type some trees are over 6000 tons of course these are 100 ft height.

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If goku was carrying 20 tons in the first episode of z then their 40 ton argument(goku lifts that even in kai which looks bigger)

3. In a battle we go by best feast ,not by the weaker feats often used as comedic purpose ,if they use such feats its low balling the character in general terms.

i mean they talk of superman when he's is a perfect example for this. One moment he is getting hurt by aquaman and the next he's tanking solar system level attacks .

They could have taken tons of other examples of high end feats for durability wise.

taking using physics on characters that never seem to apply them is bs , its like that blog on physics of magic in harry potter 0_0

4. right....lazy ....comparing to the character who they have claimed to have no limit, screwattck changed the characters itsself

SCREWATTACK

"whis: superman is as strong as he needs to be"

"when you put someone who has limits against someone who doesn't have limits in the first place ,well only one has limits to give it all"

even sun dip sups has his limits.

based on what he said he's omnipotent , that means he can beat odinforce thor with a flick -_-

If that statement isn't low balling against the opposite character idk what is.

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the finger beam....ok forget piccolos & vegetas durability .

so then i'm supposed to believe that an advanced space armor that can withstand Teins full power ki blast , is weaker than a stone ....sure lol

,

5. not really , the biggest AOE of striking force in DB was probably of tiens , he just destroyed a small plateau.

people say goku can bust 10 planets with his fist O_o ....lol thats a first,

but maybe its because of BOG movie goku punched through king kais planet, people generally believe king kais planet is 10 times more denser than a normal planet.

using that kind of logic makes no sense,Roshi destroyed the moon the shock wave would devastate the earth . ssj3 goku's powering up shook earth, heaven and he hell alike nothing can explain this.

things like these are upto the writers imagination not the real world laws.

6.

the same semi perfect cell that beat 16 >imp cell> 17&18 >ssj1 vegeta >freeza > racoom >>>>Sayien saga Vegeta <= planet bust.

the gap between a planet level and ASSJ level is HUGE.

an if SPC said he was going to bust a solarsystem even if its a hyperbole what would be the the extent of capability of Semi perfect cell .

.

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__________________________________________________________

i think i'll stop here

my browser crashed i had to rewrite the first half and i don't think i'm willing to rewrite and link everything again.which is 4 times longer than the first half....

besides looks like the topic would get personal so i rather not, On the pulse side screwattack has got nothing to with the powerscaling topic so it not like abandoning the thread :)

.

but if you want to continue just reply, maybe i'll be willing to continue after a day or so.

Post by DeathHero61 (237 posts) See mini bio Level 8

@flashback180: Nah i was getting tired too. I don't usually like debating DBZ in the first place unless its Dragon Ball.

Post by GrayWolf2 (343 posts) See mini bio Level 7

@othus12 said:

im gonna put into question some of the things that i find weird about PL. if you have an answer for these questions feel free to post it below!

1.-what's the minimum PL required to moon bust?

2.- what's the minimum PL required to planet bust?

3.- are those PL proportional to the size of the object? (earth is 50 times bigger, you would need 50 times more PL according to logic)

4.- going by a proportional scale: is Frieza a solar system buster? if you think so answer the next question, if not skip.

5.-why frieza couldnt one shot namek when the required power level to destroy earth is no more than 10,000?

6.- is namek 100 times bigger than earth? even if frieza held back according to his PL he should have blown it to nothing even with the 1% of his PL. explain this fallacy.

9.- why can krilin at a PL of 75,000 can cut frieza at a PL of 120,000,000?

10.- how does PL take into account special abilities like time stop, breathing in space,lifting strenght,speed,DC, and h2h skills?

11.- why should power levels be used instead of feats? (goku defeating frieza makes him a planet buster. but why should it make him multi solar system level?) elaborate.

1.) Probably around the 400ish range considering that was what piccolo was at and Roshi's Maximum Kamehameha probably multiplied his to around that level. 2.) To destroy it's core probably 18,000 given Vegeta's verbage to Goku about dodging his Galick Gun and saving himself but dooming the earth. As for annihilating it Frieza did it to a planet 10 times the size of earth at 530,000 so maybe around the 50,000 range. Give or take 10,000. Maybe. 3). Despite last comment probably not. 4.) No. He was only ever stated by the creator to be a casual planet buster. This is where fan calcs get out of hand. 5.) He clearly held back. No matter what that was what was stated and confirmed. 6.) Once again held back. 9.) Where's 7 and 8? Anyway special sharp attack I guess. 10.) For time stop, breathing in space, and h2h skills it doesn't. Nor does it really help in lifting strength either that much. Speed as long as they don't bulk up too much yes. DC or more like potency yes as well. 11.) Because they use the same power type. It really isn't that complicated a manga and I don't know why people like to pretend it is. This isn't a jab at you I'm just not sure why people do it to this particular manga.

Post by ohgodwhy (1,593 posts) See mini bio Level 12

@othus12 said:

im gonna put into question some of the things that i find weird about PL. if you have an answer for these questions feel free to post it below!

1.-what's the minimum PL required to moon bust?

2.- what's the minimum PL required to planet bust?

3.- are those PL proportional to the size of the object? (earth is 50 times bigger, you would need 50 times more PL according to logic)

4.- going by a proportional scale: is Frieza a solar system buster? if you think so answer the next question, if not skip.

5.-why frieza couldnt one shot namek when the required power level to destroy earth is no more than 10,000?

6.- is namek 100 times bigger than earth? even if frieza held back according to his PL he should have blown it to nothing even with the 1% of his PL. explain this fallacy.

9.- why can krilin at a PL of 75,000 can cut frieza at a PL of 120,000,000?

10.- how does PL take into account special abilities like time stop, breathing in space,lifting strenght,speed,DC, and h2h skills?

11.- why should power levels be used instead of feats? (goku defeating frieza makes him a planet buster. but why should it make him multi solar system level?) elaborate.

Can I still answer this? I'll give it a go.

1) Didn't Roshi do it at slightly under 200 or there abouts?

2) I'd hazard a guess of a planet the size of Earth at around 18,000 - 20,000 to really finish it off. Moon's mass is about 1.2% of Earth's so this could stand to reason.

3) I'd say there's some sort of relationship like that, I doubt Kishi put too much thought into it.

4) If going by masses is correct then Frieza at FP would have 6,000x the power required to destroy 1 Earth mass. Looking at the mass of Jupiter and comparing it to the mass of Earth, Frieza at FP could destroy around a planet with the mass of around about 19 Earths. Likely less than this because Jupiter is a gas giant after all. Let's say 15. Still no where near the Sun though which was 333,000x more massive than the Earth. So Frieza was multi-planet buster at best IMO.

5 + 6) If Namek was truly 100x more massive than the Earth then it would explain why Frieza couldn't destroy. He could only launch an attack that would destroy it's core triggering of a chain reaction. Was Namek 100x bigger than Earth anyway? I didn't know that was stated anywhere. It might just've been because if Frieza had blown up the planet with him on it he would've likely killed himself as well.

9??) Did Krillin at 75,000 cut Frieza at 120,000,000?

10) I think PL is just the sum total of Ki, speed and other facts are proportional to Ki but some people may be faster or some people may be stronger.

11) DBZ up until the end of the Namek arc ran on PLs. They were a good measuring stick I suppose. Toriyama had stated that he intended for DBZ to end at the Namek arc and that would've been the end of PLs too but due to fan demand DBZ was made to continue. All PLs after the Namek arc are pretty much made up and pointless so I usually try not to use them if I can.

Post by GrayWolf2 (343 posts) See mini bio Level 7

Whoa, just noticed the namek being 100 times larger thing! Where did that come from?

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