Watch & Learn: COWBOY BEBOP #13

Topic started by No_name_here on Oct. 4, 2010. Last post by vergilius 4 years, 6 months ago.
Post by No_name_here (871 posts) See mini bio Level 11
 Vicious' appearance is less a warning of danger than it is of befuddlement.
 Vicious' appearance is less a warning of danger than it is of befuddlement.

Before anything else, I’m going to bring up something my roommate mentioned (since he watched this show in college.) So there’s some theory among fans that everything after “Toys in the Attic” is either a dream or some paradisiacal vision from the afterlife - - because the crew all died after their encounter with that monster?!?! Good lord, that sounds stupid. I don’t see it myself, yet, and I don’t know why people have such a fascination with interpreting a story in this way, in general. It basically invalidates all the drama you’ve watched. It’s like how a lot of my friends got so caught up in whether the ending of INCEPTION proved that everything was a dream. Maybe it was, maybe it wasn’t - - the spinning top was meant to be ambiguous - - but I was a lot less interested in discussing that junk than I was in what the movie had to say about meme theory.

I digress, I know. The message of that diatribe is that I really hope there isn’t any substance to "post-'Toys in the Attic' dream" discussion, because it’d really take COWBOY BEBOP down a peg in my eyes.

Actually, seeing as how I said "ambiguous" back there, I'll mention that I, once again, had trouble following what was going on in this episode. None-too-coincidentally, the last time I had that problem with this show was the last time Vicious showed up. I get the feeling I’m going to appreciate this the same way I appreciated the X-FILES - - that is, I’ll vastly prefer the “perp of the week” episodes over the "mythology" ones. See, I’ve thought about this episode for a bit and I’m still not entirely clear on why or how that androgynous jazz man had big ol' boobies, or how that plasique bomb briefcase of his just came out of nowhere. Again, I was focusing on stuff I enjoyed… like Ed’s food game with Ein and the odd Sting sound-alike they got for the soundtrack and the fact that Jet’s voice actor sounds kind of like a sitcom Dad. 

Tom Pinchuk’s the writer of    HYBRID BASTARDS! &   UNIMAGINABLE . Order them on Amazon here  &  here .

Post by WarlordPayne (33 posts) See mini bio Level 5
I view Toys in the Attic as a silly little one-off episode that has no bearing on the characters or storyline and was just put in for laughs.  It's played off as a joke right through to the previews where Ed talks about everyone being dead and the show will now be called "Cowgirl Ed." 
I'm amazed that some people think that everyone really died there and the rest was a dream, but the idea that the remaining episodes are a vision of paradise is completely absurd. 
Post by LiberalTugboat (5 posts) See mini bio Level 3
Thanks for the Inception spoiler! 
Post by endaround (19 posts) See mini bio Level 7
You really need to pay close attention to these type of episodes if you want to get it all.  Grin explained to Faye he was betrayed by Vicious (who was the real spy), sent to jail and then volunteered for drug tests that left him in his current "shape"  and terminally ill.  The briefcase was the "payment" Vicious gave to Grin.  Basically Vicious was trying to tie up loose ends and make a deal at the same time.  
 Also you get that Spike's enhanced.
Post by zaldar (1,368 posts) See mini bio Level 15

to quote above for truth...there is no way this is some version of paradise they are in now...especially given the ending.  The fandom is going crazy there, and before you mentioned it I had never heard that theory before...and I hang out in places rife with crazy theroies...the stuff I have heard people say about eva....I didn't enjoy the mythology of this show much either which is likely why I didn't like ti very much in the end.  (I'll have another question for you when we finish this show that may lead to a larger discussion...nothing icky this time promise). 
Ed is always hilarious and yes the toys in the attic was a funny one off episode that I treat as if it didn't really happen.  I mean it did take place in the devils toilet after all...
Post by Korne (11 posts) See mini bio Level 3
Jupiter Jazz was one of those episodes I've gone back and forth with. I like how they turn Fey into a real character (and she ends up being the best one IMO, even after all of the shit she did in the beginning). At the same time, the whole "Vicious backstabbed me" thing was a bit rediculous to me.  
Post by FoxxFireArt (2,654 posts) See mini bio Level 25
I've never seen Inception. So, I don't really get the reference.
I'm not sure where people got the idea that drama is such a bad thing. It's not as if it's soap opera, where they make drama just for the sake of drama.
I blame reality TV for numbing the senses of audiences. People are deluged by all this psuedo-reality drama that they have little appreciation of well done drama in story telling.
I had no problems with this episode. The character had breasts, because he was sent to a jail where the prisoners were given experimental drugs. He was most likely given experimental hormones. These sort of actions have been done in the past, but were considered crimes. One of the most heinous was the Tuskegee Study that took place from the 30's through the 70's.   
I don't enjoy it when a story lays the exposition on too heavy, because no one really talks in that manner. It feels even more out of place in a drama if people are explaining every little detail.
Post by vergilius (147 posts) See mini bio Level 13
I don't think any critical viewer worth their salt puts anything in the "everything after Toys in the Attic is a dream" theory...the theory I had heard was that the movie was a dream, which is slightly more plausible, but not really.
I think Tom is going to love episode 14.  Anyone else agree?
endaround noted above that the important character points in this two-parter are kinda subtle.  This is one of the reasons I think Bebop rewards rewatching; the other is that you can pay more attention to the music the second go-around.
Seriously, the music is awesome.  Video embed seems to still be broken, so I'll just put the URL below.
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