Battles

Who wins? Provide logical arguments and do not say "This team curbstomps", explain why which team wins and in this case do not say Team 2 wins because they have Ares who is an Olympian god, give good reasons based on the character's showings and not titles or claims.

Good match up Sasuke is powerful enough to fight Jiy or Ares one on one. But I don't think Wolverine could fight Jiy on his own. With that said basing this on current feats, Sasuke uses up this Chakra too fast and Jiy is more then aware of his limits. Wolverine can be hot headed as can Saskue. But Jiy is more likly to give advice to his team mate then the rival team are to help each other. I give this to team 2 in a epic battle that results in Wolverine being Ko'd by Ares after him and Jiy swap over oppennts half way into the battle, leaving a two on one fight with the favour in the current god of wars area along with The Toad sage backing him up.

@FLCL1 said:

" @Little_Sparrow said:

"Good match up Sasuke is powerful enough to fight Jiy or Ares one on one. But I don't think Wolverine could fight Jiy on his own. With that said basing this on current feats, Sasuke uses up this Chakra too fast and Jiy is more then aware of his limits. Wolverine can be hot headed as can Saskue. But Jiy is more likly to give advice to his team mate then the rival team are to help each other. I give this to team 2 in a epic battle that results in Wolverine being Ko'd by Ares after him and Jiy swap over oppennts half way into the battle, leaving a two on one fight with the favour in the current god of wars area along with The Toad sage backing him up. "

i disagree with that first state ment jiy has stood up  to pain and lasted    nd i kno for a fact saskue wouldnt last a second "

 really have you read the recent issues of Naruto? In his current stage of power Sasuke has faced the five Kage's that is no small feat, He could stand toe to toe with Jiy even for a small amount of time. You are underestimating him greatly if you think he won't last a moment. 

@FLCL1 said:

" which ares? "

Marvel Ares.

@Little_Sparrow said:

" Good match up Sasuke is powerful enough to fight Jiy or Ares one on one. But I don't think Wolverine could fight Jiy on his own. With that said basing this on current feats, Sasuke uses up this Chakra too fast and Jiy is more then aware of his limits. Wolverine can be hot headed as can Saskue. But Jiy is more likly to give advice to his team mate then the rival team are to help each other. I give this to team 2 in a epic battle that results in Wolverine being Ko'd by Ares after him and Jiy swap over oppennts half way into the battle, leaving a two on one fight with the favour in the current god of wars area along with The Toad sage backing him up. "

I don't think Ares could defeat Wolverine.  
 
1. Wolverine is more skilled in fighting than Ares. Though Ares is The God Of War and has had thousands of years of combat experience but in most if not all of his fights he brawls and has never shown any fighting skill unlike Wolverine who has shown the sufficient skill to fight Captain America, and defeat several of Marvel's top martial artists. 
 
2. Though Ares is vastly stronger than Wolverine it really isn't much in his favor. Wolverine has held his own against The Hulk and has actually defeated him once and The Hulk has much higher physical attributes than Ares and while Ares is strong if he even manages to KO Wolverine before being badly cut than he wins however there is the big difference in speed. Ares hasn't shown any speed while Wolverine has been fast enough to dodge Cyclops' optic blasts at blank point range and Cyclops' aim and precision is nearly unrivaled.  
 
3. Some may say that Ares hasn't shown his skill however another comparison could be Hercules and Captain America. Hercules has trained for thousands of years however Captain America is a better fighter than him. The same applies between Wolverine and Ares, the Marvel Handbook states that Wolverine has higher combat skill than Ares.

@FLCL1 said:

" @Newdeath said:

" @Little_Sparrow said:

" Good match up Sasuke is powerful enough to fight Jiy or Ares one on one. But I don't think Wolverine could fight Jiy on his own. With that said basing this on current feats, Sasuke uses up this Chakra too fast and Jiy is more then aware of his limits. Wolverine can be hot headed as can Saskue. But Jiy is more likly to give advice to his team mate then the rival team are to help each other. I give this to team 2 in a epic battle that results in Wolverine being Ko'd by Ares after him and Jiy swap over oppennts half way into the battle, leaving a two on one fight with the favour in the current god of wars area along with The Toad sage backing him up. "

I don't think Ares could defeat Wolverine.   1. Wolverine is more skilled in fighting than Ares. Though Ares is The God Of War and has had thousands of years of combat experience but in most if not all of his fights he brawls and has never shown any fighting skill unlike Wolverine who has shown the sufficient skill to fight Captain America, and defeat several of Marvel's top martial artists.  2. Though Ares is vastly stronger than Wolverine it really isn't much in his favor. Wolverine has held his own against The Hulk and has actually defeated him once and The Hulk has much higher physical attributes than Ares and while Ares is strong if he even manages to KO Wolverine before being badly cut than he wins however there is the big difference in speed. Ares hasn't shown any speed while Wolverine has been fast enough to dodge Cyclops' optic blasts at blank point range and Cyclops' aim and precision is nearly unrivaled.   3. Some may say that Ares hasn't shown his skill however another comparison could be Hercules and Captain America. Hercules has trained for thousands of years however Captain America is a better fighter than him. The same applies between Wolverine and Ares, the Marvel Handbook states that Wolverine has higher combat skill than Ares. "

go to the hulk and ares vs hec and wolverine thread on comic vine the fanboyism is great there lol there is no way wolverine can beat ares "

Wolverine can defeat Ares. Explain why you think Ares can defeat Wolverine.

@FLCL1 said:

" @Newdeath said:

" @FLCL1 said:

" @Newdeath said:

" @Little_Sparrow said:

" Good match up Sasuke is powerful enough to fight Jiy or Ares one on one. But I don't think Wolverine could fight Jiy on his own. With that said basing this on current feats, Sasuke uses up this Chakra too fast and Jiy is more then aware of his limits. Wolverine can be hot headed as can Saskue. But Jiy is more likly to give advice to his team mate then the rival team are to help each other. I give this to team 2 in a epic battle that results in Wolverine being Ko'd by Ares after him and Jiy swap over oppennts half way into the battle, leaving a two on one fight with the favour in the current god of wars area along with The Toad sage backing him up. "

I don't think Ares could defeat Wolverine.   1. Wolverine is more skilled in fighting than Ares. Though Ares is The God Of War and has had thousands of years of combat experience but in most if not all of his fights he brawls and has never shown any fighting skill unlike Wolverine who has shown the sufficient skill to fight Captain America, and defeat several of Marvel's top martial artists.  2. Though Ares is vastly stronger than Wolverine it really isn't much in his favor. Wolverine has held his own against The Hulk and has actually defeated him once and The Hulk has much higher physical attributes than Ares and while Ares is strong if he even manages to KO Wolverine before being badly cut than he wins however there is the big difference in speed. Ares hasn't shown any speed while Wolverine has been fast enough to dodge Cyclops' optic blasts at blank point range and Cyclops' aim and precision is nearly unrivaled.   3. Some may say that Ares hasn't shown his skill however another comparison could be Hercules and Captain America. Hercules has trained for thousands of years however Captain America is a better fighter than him. The same applies between Wolverine and Ares, the Marvel Handbook states that Wolverine has higher combat skill than Ares. "

go to the hulk and ares vs hec and wolverine thread on comic vine the fanboyism is great there lol there is no way wolverine can beat ares "

Wolverine can defeat Ares. Explain why you think Ares can defeat Wolverine. "

power=70 tons speed feats=none weapon= long axe and advanced fighting skill "

Oh please FLCL1 I didn't expect this from you.  
 
1. His strength doesn't matter. Wolverine has fought opponents much stronger than Ares e.g The Hulk, The Thing and Wendigo to name a few. Indeed one straight punch from Ares to Wolverine's skull would knock him unconscious however Ares is too slow to barely touch him, even The Hulk is faster than Ares and he has a very hard time landing a single blow on Wolverine, Wolverine has also defeated The Hulk who is several times stronger than Ares so in terms of strength it doesn't really matter when you cannot hit your opponent because he is too fast for you and when he has defeated people much stronger than you.  
 
2. Correct. Ares has no speed feats so we cannot assume he is faster than Wolverine who has very impressive speed feats such as dodging Cyclops' optic blast at blank point range, Cyclops has nearly unrivaled precision and aim so you can see the speed Wolverine has. Wolverine is fast enough to cut Ares several times before he can properly react.
 
3. Ares' axe is made of adamantine which is stronger than Wolverine's adamantium however Ares has barely been able to hit anyone with that axe, even The Hulk who is several times slower than Wolverine was able to easily dodge it, Ares is far too slow to hit Wolverine with that axe, being that slow would grant Wolverine who is very fast several openings. Unlike Wolverine's weapons which are part of his body his adamantium claws are nearly as strong as adamantine and his claws are easier and faster to use than Ares' axe. 
 
4. Ares doesn't have advanced fighting skill. If anything he is just a brawler, Ares has never displayed skill at all let alone having greater skill than Wolverine. Yes Ares is The God Of War but that is a title he was chosen to have not a titled he earned, Ares has trained for thousands of years but he was proven to have less skill than She-Hulk who in turn has less skill than Wolverine, Ares has only proven mastery in two forms of fighting: Boxing and Wreslting while Wolverine is a master samurai, ninja, has nearly equaled Captain America in terms of skill and he has defeated Shang Chi who is one of the best fighters in Marvel and Wolverine bested him when he was in his feral state where he has even less skill. The Marvel Handbook also puts Wolverine highly above Ares in terms of skill. 
 
5. Ares' durability is nothing that cannot be taken care of by Wolverine. Ares has been one-shotted by Green Scar (World War Hulk) and Hercules while Wolverine managed to remain conscious after having been hit with several blows from Green Scar. Ares isn't even as durable as The Hulk who Wolverine has cut up pretty badly and defeated, Wolverine has even frightened Hercules when Hercules was cut by his claws. 
 
Overall there is a very slim chance of Ares winning this battle. Wolverine has also defeated much more than Ares in The Hulk.

@Newdeath said:

" @Little_Sparrow said:

" Good match up Sasuke is powerful enough to fight Jiy or Ares one on one. But I don't think Wolverine could fight Jiy on his own. With that said basing this on current feats, Sasuke uses up this Chakra too fast and Jiy is more then aware of his limits. Wolverine can be hot headed as can Saskue. But Jiy is more likly to give advice to his team mate then the rival team are to help each other. I give this to team 2 in a epic battle that results in Wolverine being Ko'd by Ares after him and Jiy swap over oppennts half way into the battle, leaving a two on one fight with the favour in the current god of wars area along with The Toad sage backing him up. "

I don't think Ares could defeat Wolverine.   1. Wolverine is more skilled in fighting than Ares. Though Ares is The God Of War and has had thousands of years of combat experience but in most if not all of his fights he brawls and has never shown any fighting skill unlike Wolverine who has shown the sufficient skill to fight Captain America, and defeat several of Marvel's top martial artists.  2. Though Ares is vastly stronger than Wolverine it really isn't much in his favor. Wolverine has held his own against The Hulk and has actually defeated him once and The Hulk has much higher physical attributes than Ares and while Ares is strong if he even manages to KO Wolverine before being badly cut than he wins however there is the big difference in speed. Ares hasn't shown any speed while Wolverine has been fast enough to dodge Cyclops' optic blasts at blank point range and Cyclops' aim and precision is nearly unrivaled.   3. Some may say that Ares hasn't shown his skill however another comparison could be Hercules and Captain America. Hercules has trained for thousands of years however Captain America is a better fighter than him. The same applies between Wolverine and Ares, the Marvel Handbook states that Wolverine has higher combat skill than Ares. "

1. do we really need to number these!
 
2. Yes wolverine has shown more hand to hand skill, But ares is not to be under estimated, He held his own just a wolverine did in the skurll invasion. So much so that he proved himself in battle and earned a spot on the dark avengers. Ares may not be as skilled but he is a very good fighter.
 
3. As stated in my post I see Ares working better with Jiy in this battle then Sasuke working with wolverine, Let me explain what I meant by the KO on wolverine. I see Jiy doing most of  the fighting allowing Ares to get in a sucker punch or something simular that would KO wolverine. 
 
4. Sasuke as shown in the current arc is head strong and runs into battle, much like ares and Wolverine. Sasuke likes to think on his feet as the battle goes shown in the arc where he fought Des. 
 
5.Jiy is much more of a bigger picture character allowing him the edge on planning. This is not an easy battle to call, but with Jiy on the other team and considering he can enter sage mode the only real threat would be sasuke, but if Ares and Jiy can hold out long enough for his chakra to die then its a win for them.

@Little_Sparrow said:

" @Newdeath said:

" @Little_Sparrow said:

" Good match up Sasuke is powerful enough to fight Jiy or Ares one on one. But I don't think Wolverine could fight Jiy on his own. With that said basing this on current feats, Sasuke uses up this Chakra too fast and Jiy is more then aware of his limits. Wolverine can be hot headed as can Saskue. But Jiy is more likly to give advice to his team mate then the rival team are to help each other. I give this to team 2 in a epic battle that results in Wolverine being Ko'd by Ares after him and Jiy swap over oppennts half way into the battle, leaving a two on one fight with the favour in the current god of wars area along with The Toad sage backing him up. "

I don't think Ares could defeat Wolverine.   1. Wolverine is more skilled in fighting than Ares. Though Ares is The God Of War and has had thousands of years of combat experience but in most if not all of his fights he brawls and has never shown any fighting skill unlike Wolverine who has shown the sufficient skill to fight Captain America, and defeat several of Marvel's top martial artists.  2. Though Ares is vastly stronger than Wolverine it really isn't much in his favor. Wolverine has held his own against The Hulk and has actually defeated him once and The Hulk has much higher physical attributes than Ares and while Ares is strong if he even manages to KO Wolverine before being badly cut than he wins however there is the big difference in speed. Ares hasn't shown any speed while Wolverine has been fast enough to dodge Cyclops' optic blasts at blank point range and Cyclops' aim and precision is nearly unrivaled.   3. Some may say that Ares hasn't shown his skill however another comparison could be Hercules and Captain America. Hercules has trained for thousands of years however Captain America is a better fighter than him. The same applies between Wolverine and Ares, the Marvel Handbook states that Wolverine has higher combat skill than Ares. "

1. do we really need to number these!  2. Yes wolverine has shown more hand to hand skill, But ares is not to be under estimated, He held his own just a wolverine did in the skurll invasion. So much so that he proved himself in battle and earned a spot on the dark avengers. Ares may not be as skilled but he is a very good fighter.  3. As stated in my post I see Ares working better with Jiy in this battle then Sasuke working with wolverine, Let me explain what I meant by the KO on wolverine. I see Jiy doing most of  the fighting allowing Ares to get in a sucker punch or something simular that would KO wolverine.   4. Sasuke as shown in the current arc is head strong and runs into battle, much like ares and Wolverine. Sasuke likes to think on his feet as the battle goes shown in the arc where he fought Des.   5.Jiy is much more of a bigger picture character allowing him the edge on planning. This is not an easy battle to call, but with Jiy on the other team and considering he can enter sage mode the only real threat would be sasuke, but if Ares and Jiy can hold out long enough for his chakra to die then its a win for them. "

1. Ares isn't a very good fighter. He brawls mostly. The only reason he was able to hold his own in The Secret Invasion is because of his raw power and he earned the spot in the Dark Avengers not because of skill that impressed them but because Norman Osborn needed a god who has the ruthlessness of Wolverine. Ares has mastered a few fighting styles at best, he has only mastered traditional Greek hand to hand combat which are not in the same league as the martial arts Wolverine has mastered.
 
2. I don't think Ares and Jiraya will work together at all. Ares is not one to work with his teammates. Ares actually shot a team member of his with an arrow so that he could fight Hercules on his own and he tried to fight The Hulk by disobeying orders. Ares will highly likely try to lead the team. 
 
3. Correct about Sasuke and Ares however Wolverine is not as strong as any of them, there have been times where Wolverine has shown strategic genius and has played on his opponent's weaknesses while Ares brawls and is one of the reasons She-Hulk defeated him.  
 
4. Ares hasn't shown much if anything impressive. He was one-shotted by both Hercules and The Hulk. Also Wolverine has fought and defeated much more than Ares in The Hulk. The numbering is my thing, you don't have to do it.

1. Ares is a good fighter, just not the best. Yes he brawls but you are wrong about his place on the dark avengers, Ruthlessness of wolverine falls to darken and bullseye not on ares, ares is placed on the team as he is raw power that is easy to manipulate. As i said in my last post only way to get a Ko is a lucky shot on wolverine!
 
2. I disagree here yes ares has done that true,but before the dark avengers he was an avenger and worked well in a team. I can name plenty of instance where he has worked with Iron man and others to get a  result.  Yes there is times he wants to fight enemies he knows but ares is not as stupid as people think he likes to know his enemies limits before a fight. his biggest weakness is his ego.
 
3. true but you are not factoring in Jiy strategic skill into that whole debate. Ares will be hot headed to start and Jiy will use that to his advantage. I don't think Sasuke is strong enough to deal with Jiy yet and wolverine is nowhere near him, in my eyes ares is cannon fodder. While wolverine will see Jiy as the real threat this is where Ares may get his sucker punch in.
 
4. Please stop bringing up the hulk, he is one of the worst written characters to date. Capt Brit has beat him,Jugs, Storm, Doc Samson, Luke Cage, Ironman, The list goes on, just using that as an arugment is not the best way to get the point across. Yes Ares was one shot by the hulk, but Wolverine has never offical beat the Hulk! he has just gone toe to toe with him. Wolverine todate has been torn apart by the hulk, everybone in his body broken by the hulk and in another world eatten by the hulkand the hulk is a brawler with over the top strength. Using the  Hulk is over kill there is arugments for against him all the time. On the other side of that Wolverine has been beaten by weaker people then him, Bullseye, Speedball. I think the best way is to find someone close to ares that Wolverine has fought....thats not the hulk.

I got to split wont be on tomorrow, been fun debating with you ND.

@Little_Sparrow said:

" 1. Ares is a good fighter, just not the best. Yes he brawls but you are wrong about his place on the dark avengers, Ruthlessness of wolverine falls to darken and bullseye not on ares, ares is placed on the team as he is raw power that is easy to manipulate. As i said in my last post only way to get a Ko is a lucky shot on wolverine!  2. I disagree here yes ares has done that true,but before the dark avengers he was an avenger and worked well in a team. I can name plenty of instance where he has worked with Iron man and others to get a  result.  Yes there is times he wants to fight enemies he knows but ares is not as stupid as people think he likes to know his enemies limits before a fight. his biggest weakness is his ego.  3. true but you are not factoring in Jiy strategic skill into that whole debate. Ares will be hot headed to start and Jiy will use that to his advantage. I don't think Sasuke is strong enough to deal with Jiy yet and wolverine is nowhere near him, in my eyes ares is cannon fodder. While wolverine will see Jiy as the real threat this is where Ares may get his sucker punch in.  4. Please stop bringing up the hulk, he is one of the worst written characters to date. Capt Brit has beat him,Jugs, Storm, Doc Samson, Luke Cage, Ironman, The list goes on, just using that as an arugment is not the best way to get the point across. Yes Ares was one shot by the hulk, but Wolverine has never offical beat the Hulk! he has just gone toe to toe with him. Wolverine todate has been torn apart by the hulk, everybone in his body broken by the hulk and in another world eatten by the hulkand the hulk is a brawler with over the top strength. Using the  Hulk is over kill there is arugments for against him all the time. On the other side of that Wolverine has been beaten by weaker people then him, Bullseye, Speedball. I think the best way is to find someone close to ares that Wolverine has fought....thats not the hulk. "

1. Ares has never shown fighting skills. They are legendary because throughout his time he has been known as The God Of War and a great fighter during his time however The Marvel Handbook lists him clearly low in terms of fighting skills so he is not that good of a fighter. I'd think of him as a decent fighter. Dakken isn't ruthless he is manipulative, Bullseye is also not ruthless, the main reason Ares was recruited into an Avengers team was because of his ruthlessness that was similar to Wolverine's.  
 
2. Ares only works well with people he respects. Since Jiraya is a random ninja he does not know Ares will likely not work with him, even though all of Jiraya's accomplishments and skill are impressive Ares is not one to care unless it is shown and even then he does not care. An example would be during World War Hulk, he was clearly bested by Hulk who effortlessly knocked him away and even after World War Hulk ended he did not learn his lesson and when he encountered Hulk once again his ego got the best of him and he challenged Hulk once more however they were stopped before the fight could continue, unless Ares is leading this team he will not work well with Jiraya. Ares acted disrespectful towards Zeus during an invasion on Olympus where he was required to assist them in battling the invading gods and he most of the time let his ego and anger get the best of him. 
 
3. I agree with this however during the beginning of the fight Wolverine will likely rush towards a familiar opponent Ares and will fight him however if Wolverine makes the mistake of fighting Jiraya then he has surely sealed his fate but if Ares attempts to fight Sasuke he too will be defeated however the chances are that Team 2 will have better team work than team 1 due to the various different personalities especially Sasuke who has become overconfident. 
 
4. The Hulk that was beaten by Doc Samson and Iron Man was Classic Hulk, during that period of time virtually any comic book character could defeat anyone as shown when Doc Samson defeated Hercules, Wonder Man, Namor and Iron Man and doing that is clearly out of his capabilities. Alternate Universes do not count so saying that Hulk ate an alternate version of Wolverine does not apply because alternate counterparts tend to be weaker than their 616 counterparts. No. Wolverine has fought weaker people and has been defeated by them both who have advantages over The Hulk and Ares, because Bullseye and Speedball are much faster than Ares and Hulk have better chances of hitting Wolverine, the same goes for Wolverine being defeated by someone like Spider-Man, yes he is vastly weaker than The Hulk and Ares yet he has many advantages they do not have, while Ares and Wolverine have a very hard time trying to catch Wolverine, Spider-Man already has the sufficient strength to KO him and because of his speed and agility he can easily land several blows.

Ugh...I hate sasuke hes to popular -.-"  
so for that Jiraya and Ares win