Toriko vs Nappa

Topic started by supernova7005 on June 10, 2013. Last post by 5th 8 months, 3 weeks ago.
Post by supernova7005 (1,966 posts) See mini bio Level 15

@jnw93: @Theorder14: Why do people always keep thinking Busting power is all that matters in a fight?

Roshi, who can bust the moon, can't even beat the street level Red Ribbon army or the grenade-level Tao Pai

Post by othus12 (6,198 posts) See mini bio Level 12

@supernova7005 said:

@jnw93: @Theorder14: Why do people always keep thinking Busting power is all that matters in a fight?

Roshi, who can bust the moon, can't even beat the street level Red Ribbon army or the grenade-level Tao Pai

exactly.

Post by GIRUGAMESH (2,136 posts) See mini bio Level 9

@supernova7005 said:

@jnw93: @Theorder14: Why do people always keep thinking Busting power is all that matters in a fight?

Roshi, who can bust the moon, can't even beat the street level Red Ribbon army or the grenade-level Tao Pai

He was only 'grenade-level' after being severely weakened. As has been stated time and time again on these threads, DBZ characters weaken in all aspect as they lose ki.

As for the Roshi thing, the RR Army had quite a few resources; including hitmen such as Pai Pai, amongst other things.

Agreed though on the busting thing, since Roshi's full power kamehameha takes a while to charge it's not often that he'd be able to use it in a fight. However, that isn't the case with Nappa, who can casually cause country-busting attacks (at least) just by flipping someone off. Your argument of 'he's small, so only a bit of the blast will affect him' is pretty silly. If a person gets hit by a nuke with an blast radius of 5km, and another gets hit by one with a radius of 10km, both will be destroyed just as well. Where the heck are you getting the 'Toriko is faster' thing from as well? The last time I checked, Toriko wasn't DBZ level in that department.

Toriko loses.

@jnw93 said:

@ImDictatorBowDown said:

This is completely casual Nappa

This

Piccolo in the Saiyan Saga managed to blow up the moon

and rememeber how Nappa died?

Vegeta just blew his ass up

You cant put Toriko against DBZ chars ¬_¬

This.

Post by othus12 (6,198 posts) See mini bio Level 12

@GIRUGAMESH: the world in dragon ball is not the same size as ours. its consirably smaller.

anyways that explosion isnt that impresive. in the world of toriko the humans made an attack on this scale:

well of course in their world it would have looked like this:

and lets see what zebura thought about them:

yup he just called them scum. the nappa+ level attack you praise was considered scum to zebura. is there a way you can prove that nappa's attack was stronger? there is not. they had the same blast radius (only if the DB world were as big as our earth which it isnt) and same destructive power (if not less from nappa because the mountains were still there after the attack)

besides regarding tao pai pai.

you really mean to tell us that after some punches of kid goku suddenly tao pai pai stopped being moon durability and somehow he became grenade level? that cant be even with his ki downed to the max.

Post by Son_Wukong (221 posts) See mini bio Level 7

@othus12:Dude, if your gonna make a claim such as:

"the world in dragon ball is not the same size as ours. its consirably smaller."

I'm gonna need some backing up from some official sources. Because the only shred of official proof we have regarding the size of the DB world is from this interview with Toriyama:

Here he says in the DB world the moon is 380,000km away from the Earth just like IRL. This leads me to believe that the world in DB is also the same size as the IRL Earth.

After Nappa was done the whole place was a desolate wasteland with no mountains there at all.

Honestly dude no offence but you sound like a downplayer pulling things out of his ass. Also note that the saiyan space pods survived Nappa's country buster, giving them some damn good durability. Yet an enraged Gohan with a PL of 1300 easily smashed out of one with his head:

Regarding Tao Pai Pai, I don't think he has moon level durability anyway since I regard Roshi's feat as an outlier. But what he does have is the ability to throw pillars from one side of the globe (2300km) to the other at mach 8 speeds needing millions of tons of force in order to do.

http://z.mfcdn.net/store/manga/214/06-085.0/compressed/mimg013.jpg

This is an example of DB characters using their ki and strength together in order to pull impressive feats instead of just physical muscle alone when they're gravity/weight training and so don't look as impressive.

Post by GIRUGAMESH (2,136 posts) See mini bio Level 9

@Son_Wukong said:

@othus12:Dude, if your gonna make a claim such as:

"the world in dragon ball is not the same size as ours. its consirably smaller."

I'm gonna need some backing up from some official sources. Because the only shred of official proof we have regarding the size of the DB world is from this interview with Toriyama:

Here he says in the DB world the moon is 380,000km away from the Earth just like IRL. This leads me to believe that the world in DB is also the same size as the IRL Earth.

After Nappa was done the whole place was a desolate wasteland with no mountains there at all.

Honestly dude no offence but you sound like a downplayer pulling things out of his ass. Also note that the saiyan space pods survived Nappa's country buster, giving them some damn good durability. Yet an enraged Gohan with a PL of 1300 easily smashed out of one with his head:

Regarding Tao Pai Pai, I don't think he has moon level durability anyway since I regard Roshi's feat as an outlier. But what he does have is the ability to throw pillars from one side of the globe (2300km) to the other at mach 8 speeds needing millions of tons of force in order to do.

http://z.mfcdn.net/store/manga/214/06-085.0/compressed/mimg013.jpg

This is an example of DB characters using their ki and strength together in order to pull impressive feats instead of just physical muscle alone when they're gravity/weight training and so don't look as impressive.

Don't think I've seen you on here before, welcome to the Vice. Nice to have someone with intelligence joining our ranks.

@othus12 said:

@GIRUGAMESH: the world in dragon ball is not the same size as ours. its consirably smaller.

anyways that explosion isnt that impresive. in the world of toriko the humans made an attack on this scale:

well of course in their world it would have looked like this:

and lets see what zebura thought about them:

yup he just called them scum. the nappa+ level attack you praise was considered scum to zebura. is there a way you can prove that nappa's attack was stronger? there is not. they had the same blast radius (only if the DB world were as big as our earth which it isnt) and same destructive power (if not less from nappa because the mountains were still there after the attack)

besides regarding tao pai pai.

you really mean to tell us that after some punches of kid goku suddenly tao pai pai stopped being moon durability and somehow he became grenade level? that cant be even with his ki downed to the max.

I don't know if you were having a bad day or what, I never would have expected this from you. That world comparison is hilarious though, so I must thank you for that.

What, so we have a new 'Ask Zebura' corner now? Are you serious? Well done for showing a country/continental level attack by the way, I still have yet to see it. Post a scan or at least give a reference, then we'll talk. I love how you overturn your own argument by re-posting Nappa's feat and yet all you post to support Toriko is Agony Aunt Zebora saying 'Hur Dur Hur Scum'.

Moreover, I never said that Pai Pai had moon-busting durability, if you assume that then you're one of those people who assumes that destructive capacity=durability, which is not always the case. Certainly he has superhuman durability, but the role of ki in the series shouldn't be underestimated. Without it, yes, he'd be almost a regular human, the ki is what gives them their strength/power.

If you do reply, use actual feats for Toriko next time, they'll serve you better than batshit-retarded claims that try to lowball DBZ.

Post by GrayWolf2 (292 posts) See mini bio Level 7

Great so now dragonball earth is a lot smaller than ours huh. The amount of dragonball downplaying is growing ridiculously high these days. Listen: When Raditz arrived he mentioned something being a distance of 4,880 away. It turned out to be Piccolo. After he humbled him he found out that Goku was a distance of 12,909. If you know anything about Akira Toriyama's work these numbers mean Kilometers. Seeing as how Raditz ship landed I don't know maybe in the middle of the large landmass continent on Dragonball earth you can easily double that for total land. Then you add in the fact that Dragonball earth does in fact have oceans, quite large ones I might add and you can easily figure out that Dragonball earth has to be around the same size as our Earth. It's only structured differently. Where people get the idea that it is a lot smaller is beyond me. I guess they think the earth is 100,000 kilometers around that's the only explanation I can think of.

Post by supernova7005 (1,966 posts) See mini bio Level 15

@GIRUGAMESH said:

He was only 'grenade-level' after being severely weakened. As has been stated time and time again on these threads, DBZ characters weaken in all aspect as they lose ki.
As for the Roshi thing, the RR Army had quite a few resources; including hitmen such as Pai Pai, amongst other things.

Tao was quite confident that the grenade would hurt Goku, who was at full power.

And he used that as a final resort, meaning he considered it to be much stronger than his normal attacks (or strong enough to hurt someone of his own level).

Your argument of 'he's small, so only a bit of the blast will affect him' is pretty silly. If a person gets hit by a nuke with an blast radius of 5km, and another gets hit by one with a radius of 10km, both will be destroyed just as well.

The person is still tanking only a fraction of the blast. He gets destroyed because the person is weak, while Toriko isn't.

Divide the area of Toriko's body to the AoE of the explosion. That's the fraction of the country buster that Toriko tanks.

Where the heck are you getting the 'Toriko is faster' thing from as well? The last time I checked, Toriko wasn't DBZ level in that department.
Toriko loses.

Toriko verse has speed feats exceeding mach 600+. When does Nappa display 'this' level of speed? Goku, who thrashed Nappa takes 28 hours to cross 1000,000 km.

Doubt if Nappa's even in the triple digit range, let alone Mach 600

Post by othus12 (6,198 posts) See mini bio Level 12

@GIRUGAMESH: i was using the good ol powerscailing i thought someone like you would have alredy seen this scan since it has been on the forums since forever but ok im posting it again. havent you realized that an attack on that scale didnt even made the mounturtle flinch and that monster is about level 140 yet zebura destroyed that monster with one punch and toriko has also killed monsters on that level so you can take a guess.

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-toriko has also killed beasts on the same level as mounturtle. that's why im using these scans here he kills gaoh who has just about the same capture level.

what is so hilarious about my comparison? i surrounded exactly the same area. have you realized the world in toriko includes our world take a good look before calling somebody an idiot. i surrounded the USA becuse that's about 10 million square kilometers.

besides i gotta add from what supernova said that toriko characters have speed feats up to mach 30,000. not saying that toriko is mach 30k. just saying some characters in toriko have those speeds.

Post by othus12 (6,198 posts) See mini bio Level 12

@Son_Wukong: let me tell you why that's bullshit.

first the pods surviving nappa's attack show you that the blast itself wasnt really that powerful. why? because nappa has a damn power level of 4000. so now gohan with 1300 can destroy the pod but nappa with 4000 cannot? fuck logics right? the only possible reason for that is that nappa cannot deploy that much energy with that attack or toriyama messed up BADLY. other thing that bothers me is that in the official wiki when they decribe his attack they say: Nappa powers up his energy and raises two fingers in the air to create a large explosion around him. He can be seen performing this attack to destroyEast City when he first arrives on Earth with Vegeta. does that mean the attack was city level? was the showing purely brightness? that could be.

show me one decent punching feat from tao pai pai. just one. good luck with that. if you have anything else that supports that tao can lift millions of tons then go ahead. tao cant fly so toriyama gave him means of transport.

im saying that the earth in dragon ball is smaller than ours because of some reasons that arent official but its just common sense.

first i gotta say that the distance between their moon and their earth means absolutely nothing that could be scaled.

now think about it. frieza with 530K uses his best attack for planet bust. even namek held for the entire fight between goku and frieza (which didnt lasted long but still it took friezas best attack to destroy it)

if vegeta (who had 18k claimed that he could instantly destroy earth) that would mean that earth is wayyyy smaller than namek (at least over 20 times if we go by their PL)

now goku has been calced at mach 300ish http://www.narutoforums.com/blog.php?b=15589 and goku traveled from one side of namek to the other in few minutes. that means its not that namek is enormus, its just that earth is small.

Post by ChromeDisaster (1,099 posts) See mini bio Level 11

@othus12 said:

@GIRUGAMESH: i was using the good ol powerscailing i thought someone like you would have alredy seen this scan since it has been on the forums since forever but ok im posting it again. havent you realized that an attack on that scale didnt even made the mounturtle flinch and that monster is about level 140 yet zebura destroyed that monster with one punch and toriko has also killed monsters on that level so you can take a guess.

-

-

-

-

-

-toriko has also killed beasts on the same level as mounturtle. that's why im using these scans here he kills gaoh who has just about the same capture level.

what is so hilarious about my comparison? i surrounded exactly the same area. have you realized the world in toriko includes our world take a good look before calling somebody an idiot. i surrounded the USA becuse that's about 10 million square kilometers.

besides i gotta add from what supernova said that toriko characters have speed feats up to mach 30,000. not saying that toriko is mach 30k. just saying some characters in toriko have those speeds.

I agree

Post by SMXLR8 (6,827 posts) See mini bio Level 16

LOL so this has come to which world is smaller? yeah ok

Post by GrayWolf2 (292 posts) See mini bio Level 7

@othus12: Goku traveled from one side of Namek to the other in a few seconds, not minutes. Freeza held back much of his power when he destroyed Namek. This is common knowledge. Goku confirms this and says if Freeza wanted to he could just blast the planet again and be done with it. Freeza did destroy planet Vegeta which is much larger than the earth. Also you wanna believe that Dragonball earth is so small then the gravity training that these characters talk about is now totally useless since 1G to them is much less than 1G to us. Either that or their is something in the manga that states that Dragonball earth is denser than our own. Also it is over 10,000kilometers from the rocky mountain area they fight a lot to the Turtle hermits house. Place that on the Dragonball Earth map and that's only a small distance compared to the whole thing. Dragonball earth is roughly around the size of ours. If it's smaller it is only slightly. Hell it may be even a little bigger you never know.

Post by othus12 (6,198 posts) See mini bio Level 12

@GrayWolf2: well i dont want to make a big deal out of it since that's not what matters. the attack is still on the same scale as the mounturtle even considering db world as the same size as ours.even though for namek goku at mach 300 (some dude said 6000 but everybody bashed him) to arrive in seconds from the other side of namek makes no sense.

EDIT: unless my theory is right and dragon ball earth is smaller lol. also can you show me the map? that would be cool.

Post by One_Piece_God (540 posts) See mini bio Level 8

Nappa wins until toriko can blow up a planet end of.

Post by GrayWolf2 (292 posts) See mini bio Level 7

@othus12: Goku at best would only be mach 300 when he first arrived on namek. When he did the feat everyone is talking about he was 30times more powerful and thus would be a lot faster. As for a good map I'm having trouble putting it on here, but if you do a simple image search you can easily find it.

Post by othus12 (6,198 posts) See mini bio Level 12

@One_Piece_God: no just no. read trough all the comments if you want to even realize why are we still debating.

@GrayWolf2: that feat was immediately when he got out of his ship. and saiyans dont become 30 times stronger with zenkai. they at most double their power level. btw i saw the official map and measured with pixel ruler the distance from kamehouse to the place goku and vegeta fought (10,000 km) i grabbed that and measured the entire world map. let me tell you the total size of the planet was a little below 30,000 kilometers. our earth has 40,000 kilometers. i guess that supports my theory that DB earth is smaller. here is the map in case you are wondering:

Post by taichokage (12,470 posts) See mini bio Level 20
I'm going to say this. Toriko would destroy Nappa in every scenario except 1. Nappa wins only if he does the 2 finger blast. The question is would Nappa resort to that immediately. Likely not. Also could Toriko blitz him. That's arguable. No one seems to agree on who is faster at this point. In short I'd say either could win, but Nappa only has one realistic way of doing so.
Post by Son_Wukong (221 posts) See mini bio Level 7

@othus12:No Namek saga Goku has been calced at mach 1000+

http://www.narutoforums.com/blog.php?b=19129

Also the Dragon ball wiki isn't official. It's just a database made by hard working fans. According to the manga all the other cities nearby were also affected:

http://z.mfcdn.net/store/manga/214/18-009.0/compressed/DBZ_124.jpg

Gohan busting the spacepod also makes sense. Nappa's feat was ridiculously casual. He didn't even charge his ki he simply flicked his wrist and bam: country vaped, for all we know Nappa could've only been using 1% of his power. While Gohan was bloodlusted abd pissed of using 100% of his effort in order to smash the space pod.

No it didn't take Frieza's best attack in order the destroy Namek's core it was a hastily made ki blast that Frieza made as he was shitting his pants due to a bloodlusted SSJ Goku wanting to kill him. He even admitted he held back:

Chapter: 320 (DBZ 126), P9.2
Context: after it turns out Planet Namek didn’t blow up
Freeza: “Chih…! Did I suppress my power too much…?!”
Goku: “It’s because you were afraid of getting caught up in the planet’s explosion yourself…You screwed up. Though thanks to that, I survived…”

Also when Frieza blew up Planet Vegeta in his 1st form the feat was utterly casual. Keep in mind that planet Vegeta has gravity 10X that of Earth's.

Chapter: 211 (DBZ 17), P7.4
Kaio: “Let me tell you something…The planet where the Saiyans lived had gravity at least as great as this [10 times Earth's gravity]…They used it to strengthen their bodies. [ ] Do you begin to see where they get their strength? And that's not mentioning their inborn fighting instincts. You can’t even imagine how deadly they are.”

http://www.kanzenshuu.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=15488

This makes it 10X bigger/denser than the Earth and so 10X harder to destroy than the Earth.

I wasn't saying that Toa can lift millions of tons I was just showing you how when not training DB characters have good strength feats and that lifting strength =/= striking strength. Toriyama could've easily have give Tao a hover board capsule for a means of transportation, he was even offered a plane on panel. In the 21st budokai kid Goku was casually leaving into the troposphere.

On Topic: Toriko wins he can just blitz Nappa.

Post by othus12 (6,198 posts) See mini bio Level 12

@Son_Wukong: that was a calc. on firezas death ball. the blasts aren exactly movement speed. and as some people said the actual attack took longer to reach the core. goku is fast but not mach 1000.

well i wouldnt use DB feats for DBZ. since DB is often cartoonized and sometimes they give them toonforce to the characters such as when goku literally broke the manga scan with a punch.

regarding everything else you said i totally agree.

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