Saber vs Ichigo

Topic started by Asune on Nov. 8, 2011. Last post by eddz99 1 year, 5 months ago.
Post by ReliusClover (784 posts) See mini bio Level 10

@CerusSerenade: Actually it does. Only the main original form and source for a series is the canon one. Any kind of adaptation is non-canon by default it has to be confirmed by Word of God that it is canon (even if it's not changed and is a 1:1 adaptation).

Especially in this case where the anime contradicts the Visual Novel at many points. It's pretty much this:

Anime and VN both happened at the same time.

Anime and VN both claim to be true.

Anime and VN are different from one another.

Anime or VN, one has to be wrong.

We know VN is right.

Draw the conclusion from that?

And besides who would like the FSN anime to be canon, that's a piece of shit.

Post by Frieza (240 posts) See mini bio Level 9

Man... this thread...

I don't know how anything is going to be resolved here...

Freakin' Ichigo. Lord of pulling wins out of his butt. He will probably just transform into some Vasto Lorde new form and do something.

And Saber. I don't know too much about her, but she sounds like a pretty broken character after reading stuff about her on the wiki pages.

I'm looking for someone to try and explain her to me. What she can do. Etc.

Post by CerusSerenade (2,625 posts) See mini bio Level 10

@ReliusClover: If the anime contradicts the visual novel, yes the visual novel trumps. But just because something happened in the anime doesn't mean it contradicts the visual novel.

All in all I see the whole "canon" thing being way too subjective for one person to define it, mainly because it was made up by people who watch anime and read manga like us and there is no clear definition. The argument over whether or not Dragonball GT is canon even though word of god says its offical is an example.

Post by ReliusClover (784 posts) See mini bio Level 10

@Frieza: Mach 15 combat speed, with mach 45 reactions. At full power has mach 13 movement.

Long story short she has Excalibur which atomizes the target to nothing and Avalon which shuts her off from any kind of attack or hax and potential reflects it back onto the enemy.

Post by CerusSerenade (2,625 posts) See mini bio Level 10

@ReliusClover: It also heals her of any injuries, including fatal ones. Most of that is passive too.

Post by ReliusClover (784 posts) See mini bio Level 10

@CerusSerenade: Don't really care about DBGT so can't relate to that. It's not subjective at all. Canon is supposed to be one continuity with no plot holes or contradictions. Having both the anime and VN be "true" would create a paradox as they are supposed to happen at the same time (during the Fifth Holy Grail War).

To make it easier, look at it this way:

You say that yesterday at three, you had lunch in France.

I say that yesterday at three, you killed Kennedy.

Obviously only one can be true and as we know that your statement is the "original canon" one and because mine contradicts the reality or in this case canon, it is thrown out.

Even if the anime doesn't contradict the VN, the fact that something completely different happened in the VN while the events of the anime are supposed to take place, it makes them non-canon, very simple.

Post by ReliusClover (784 posts) See mini bio Level 10

@CerusSerenade: The regeneration isn't that impressive. Best feats are when Kiritsugu had all his insides turned to mush by Kotomine as well as most bones broken and regenerated and Shirou having the insides of his stomach slashed out by Berserker.

Crushing the head would still do the trick.

Post by Frieza (240 posts) See mini bio Level 9

@ReliusClover: Just want to address somethings regarding what people are saying, specifically Getsuga Tenshou.

I don't know what Saber can do, but Getsuga Tenshou has been powerful enough to cleanly cut off the top portion of Tsukushima's mansion.

That's pretty impressive. So what's to imply that it cannot just simply cut right through her?

Post by ReliusClover (784 posts) See mini bio Level 10

@Frieza: The fact that she has tanked a dimension destroying, space/time ripping, hole in reality making, revealing the universe before it's creation kind of blast, which has overpowered city buster and collapsed endless pocket dimensions before. She had done so for just a moment and than had to use Avalon, but given that said blast makes GT look like a joke...

And she has better reactions anyway so she's gonna god first.

Post by Frieza (240 posts) See mini bio Level 9

@ReliusClover: Show this to me.

Post by ReliusClover (784 posts) See mini bio Level 10

@Frieza: Gonna be hard since this is a VN we're talking about...

To get an idea: Ea - the weapon. Saber tanked it's attack Enuma Elsih for a few seconds during the Fate route before activating Avalon.

But as i said, it's not necessary, Saber is faster, can one shot with Excalibur and can no sell anything Ichigo does with Avalon. The whole Enuma Elish tanking feat isn't even needed.

Post by ReliusClover (784 posts) See mini bio Level 10

@Frieza: Found it.

Post by supernova7005 (1,966 posts) See mini bio Level 15

shikai ichigo loses badly. (saber with low diff)

bankai ichigo would lose after putting up some fight (saber with mid diff)

vizard bankai ichigo would lose after a long fight (saber with high diff)

H2 ichigo would win with mid diff

dangai ichigo roflstomps, low diff. a wave of his sword will itself be too much for any servant

Post by CerusSerenade (2,625 posts) See mini bio Level 10

Dangai and H2 Ichigo kill themselves against Avalon.

Post by MohsinMan99 (1,777 posts) See mini bio Level 21

"Canon" actually varies from fiction to fiction.

Interesting stuff I feel everyone should know. If you know this already, good for you.

http://www.narutoforums.com/showthread.php?t=891614

(tl;dr read poster Tranquil Fury's post)

Post by brolybankai (15 posts) See mini bio Level 4

@Dream:

ichigo cuts the excalibur,avalon and lucy in two

Post by brolybankai (15 posts) See mini bio Level 4

@Dream:

ichigo dangai is trancendental, and saber is not trancendental.

saigo no getsuga tenshou is superior to trancendental.

ichigo stomps.

nothing can reach trancendental

Post by Dream (7,630 posts) See mini bio Level 21
Moderator

@brolybankai: Oh fun, another Bleach wanker. -_-*

Post by eddz99 (2,511 posts) See mini bio Level 11

@brolybankai: @Dream said:

@brolybankai: Oh fun, another Bleach wanker. -_-*

Avalon is uncuttable, it reflects anything dangai ichigo throws. Ichigo dangai is "trancendental" is just a statement which has no feats to back it up.

Post by supernova7005 (1,966 posts) See mini bio Level 15

@eddz99 said:

@brolybankai: @Dream said:

@brolybankai: Oh fun, another Bleach wanker. -_-*

Avalon is uncuttable, it reflects anything dangai ichigo throws. Ichigo dangai is "trancendental" is just a statement which has no feats to back it up.

there are enough feats. his rieatsu couldn't be sensed even by aizen and just the air pressure from his swings was changing the landscape of the earth. He is far above mountain level.

Avalon can't be used for an infinite time and will eventually run out. Saber is not getting anywhere beyond ulquiorra

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