Lucifer and Michael ( Supernatural) vs Goku

Topic started by peruano99A on June 8, 2012. Last post by tronboy 1 year, 3 months ago.
Post by Supreme Marvel (5,142 posts) See mini bio Level 12

@TheNeutralOne said:

Since this thread I have watched the entire supernatural series in hopes of seeing the epicness that is someone crazy stronger than goku. I found "gods" and these "archangels" and "higher beings" losing to boys raised as humans. I also haven't seen half of what is depicted in that database for lucifer and michael and if I have it was in no way the same as depicted because it was not very impressive. Goku should lol stomp here.

The boy was a Damien type character. Son of the devil style. Arguable on par with the likes of Michael and Lucifer.

If you watched the show, then you'd know the only way to kill an angel is to have the angel-stake or be the level of power as Michael and Lucifer. Loki/Gabriel pretended to be dead many times but kept coming back until...well you know what happened to him.

Post by Haofan123 (3,675 posts) See mini bio Level 13

@Supreme Marvel said:

@TheNeutralOne said:

Since this thread I have watched the entire supernatural series in hopes of seeing the epicness that is someone crazy stronger than goku. I found "gods" and these "archangels" and "higher beings" losing to boys raised as humans. I also haven't seen half of what is depicted in that database for lucifer and michael and if I have it was in no way the same as depicted because it was not very impressive. Goku should lol stomp here.

The boy was a Damien type character. Son of the devil style. Arguable on par with the likes of Michael and Lucifer.

If you watched the show, then you'd know the only way to kill an angel is to have the angel-stake or be the level of power as Michael and Lucifer. Loki/Gabriel pretended to be dead many times but kept coming back until...well you know what happened to him.

Yeah, in thier universe maybe. Dracula may need to be staked through the heart to die in the stoker novels, but he's sure as hell not tanking a giga drill breaker.

Also, the leviathans were able to massacre the angels and they were shit villains with even shittier powers, constantly being bested by humans like sam dean and bobby at every turn. The supernatural verse has poor credibility in terms of power.

Post by Supreme Marvel (5,142 posts) See mini bio Level 12

@Haofan123 said:

@Supreme Marvel said:

@TheNeutralOne said:

Since this thread I have watched the entire supernatural series in hopes of seeing the epicness that is someone crazy stronger than goku. I found "gods" and these "archangels" and "higher beings" losing to boys raised as humans. I also haven't seen half of what is depicted in that database for lucifer and michael and if I have it was in no way the same as depicted because it was not very impressive. Goku should lol stomp here.

The boy was a Damien type character. Son of the devil style. Arguable on par with the likes of Michael and Lucifer.

If you watched the show, then you'd know the only way to kill an angel is to have the angel-stake or be the level of power as Michael and Lucifer. Loki/Gabriel pretended to be dead many times but kept coming back until...well you know what happened to him.

Yeah, in thier universe maybe. Dracula may need to be staked through the heart to die in the stoker novels, but he's sure as hell not tanking a giga drill breaker.

Also, the leviathans were able to massacre the angels and they were shit villains with even shittier powers. The supernatural verse has poor credibility in terms of power.

Dracula or vampires in each mythological story have different ways of dying. Take Alucard, it possible could survive something like that, based on the information I have been told (need to watch that show).

Leviathans were the first creatures created by God. Although they had different motives than other villains faced, they only desire was to feed not destroy humanity. So they would lack the will to destroy them in any other way that wasn't eating them. So feats would be lacking. The only way to kill the most powerful (Dick) was God's weapon: Bone of Righteous Mortal Washed In the Three Bloods of Fallen.

Take all the things that Loki/Gabriel did to Sam and Dean, Lucifer states he taught him them. Thus, he can do them all to.

Take Goku, almost killed by a virus. In alternative reality, he did die. So he can be destroyed from the inside. One finger click away and Goku's combustion.

Post by UltimateHero0406 (5,041 posts) See mini bio Level 16

Not seeing why this is still open.

They turn Goku's organs into pudding.

And it's not like Goku can hurt them so ... yeah.

Post by Haofan123 (3,675 posts) See mini bio Level 13

@Supreme Marvel said:

@Haofan123 said:

@Supreme Marvel said:

@TheNeutralOne said:

Since this thread I have watched the entire supernatural series in hopes of seeing the epicness that is someone crazy stronger than goku. I found "gods" and these "archangels" and "higher beings" losing to boys raised as humans. I also haven't seen half of what is depicted in that database for lucifer and michael and if I have it was in no way the same as depicted because it was not very impressive. Goku should lol stomp here.

The boy was a Damien type character. Son of the devil style. Arguable on par with the likes of Michael and Lucifer.

If you watched the show, then you'd know the only way to kill an angel is to have the angel-stake or be the level of power as Michael and Lucifer. Loki/Gabriel pretended to be dead many times but kept coming back until...well you know what happened to him.

Yeah, in thier universe maybe. Dracula may need to be staked through the heart to die in the stoker novels, but he's sure as hell not tanking a giga drill breaker.

Also, the leviathans were able to massacre the angels and they were shit villains with even shittier powers. The supernatural verse has poor credibility in terms of power.

Dracula or vampires in each mythological story have different ways of dying. Take Alucard, it possible could survive something like that, based on the information I have been told (need to watch that show).

Leviathans were the first creatures created by God. Although they had different motives than other villains faced, they only desire was to feed not destroy humanity. So they would lack the will to destroy them in any other way that wasn't eating them. So feats would be lacking. The only way to kill the most powerful (Dick) was God's weapon: Bone of Righteous Mortal Washed In the Three Bloods of Fallen.

Take all the things that Loki/Gabriel did to Sam and Dean, Lucifer states he taught him them. Thus, he can do them all to.

Take Goku, almost killed by a virus. In alternative reality, he did die. So he can be destroyed from the inside. One finger click away and Goku's combustion.

I specifically gave stokers dracula as an example so its a moot point. Sure, the only way to kill him in the novel is to stake him through the heart but if he was hit by a giga drill breaker he wouldnt come back. Similarly,the only way to kill an angel in supernatural is to stab them with an angel blade but thats a no limit fallacy when applied to other fictions.

Leviathans were constantly bested by humans despite the fact that they could kill angels and supernatural pagan gods are also weaksauce. I dont see why the angels are any different escpecially considering that their best feats are talking about htier feats "durr lucifer and michael can destroy the planet." they sure showed us. oh wait. not they didnt becuase the best they did was shank eachother and kill the supernatural pagan gods who are absolutely dissapointing powerwise

Yeah. gabriel did that to sam and dean AKA humans with no superpowers besides badassery and an army of fangirls, not a superpowered alien such as goku. It should also be noted lucifer has never used such methods in combat before so he would most likely not to so here

Yes Goku was destroyed by a virus. An unknown virus of unknown origin. we dont know how it effected his body and thus saying that a simple finger snap would kill goku is quite ignorant

Post by Whats_out_the_bag (1,449 posts) See mini bio Level 10

Please someone close this thread. We have already ended this battle a long time ago.

Post by TheNeutralOne (1,016 posts) See mini bio Level 10

It would be nice of anyone to show some feats of them reacting to near light speed attacks or any energy attack on the level of kamehameha. It would also be pretty cool to show them fighting someone on par with goku in terms of battle prowess. Each other doesn't count because they haven't even been shown to be on goku's level. All they have on him is immortality and if we use goku from the buu saga when he was already dead then lucifer and michael will take ass whippings in their non corpral forms all day.

Post by Supreme Marvel (5,142 posts) See mini bio Level 12

@Haofan123: Agree there is some ups and downs in the consistency of Supernatural. But there is also loads in DBZ.

Yes Goku was destroyed by a virus. An unknown virus of unknown origin. we dont know how it effected his body and thus saying that a simple finger snap would kill goku is quite ignorant

The virus was cured in the future, it appears to have originated on Earth because Trunks said you would be taken ill by it. Goku never left Earth. So it should be an Earth virus. Meaning he should be able to get other viruses like cancer. During one of the Supernatural episodes, Zachariah I believe gave Dean stage 4 cancer which was killing him quickly. As we saw in episode The Song Remains the Same, Michael is unaffected by time. He appeared to Dean as if the conversation was taken place in Dean's timeline. While Uriel has no idea of who Sam and Dean are.

My point is Michael could possible know this virus, although I don't believe Goku could do anything to a reality warper, and give it to Goku but at a worse stage if he wanted.

I still believe Goku is click away from death.

Post by TheNeutralOne (1,016 posts) See mini bio Level 10

@Supreme Marvel: Actually no one knew the origin of the virus. For all we know he could have got it from the planet he visited before coming to earth or while in space. Couldn't it? Or how do we know it was not something planned by dr.gero that was invented to specifically fight goku just like the androids. We can never know and speculation is limitless. Arguing such a point wouldn't make sense.

P.S.- lucifer and michael know nothing about the DBZ universe or its mechanics so they would not know the disease at all or about ki for that matter.

Post by Supreme Marvel (5,142 posts) See mini bio Level 12

@TheNeutralOne: Well actually, Trunks said "In the future you'll contract a virus that will kill you". So he never had it then, or Trunks would have said take this antidote now and you'll be fine. We never saw them leave Earth, nor was it mentioned. So it's more than safe to say it was Earth born.

Plus, I'm one of the believers that the Z warriors don't move near light speed.

The Z series would be a tv show in their universe. Michael and Lucifer could possible know of it. But they could give them any other disease since we know they can contract them. Even if you believe that Gero made the virus (which I don't), you really think reality warpers of these two powers couldn't do the same?

Post by TheNeutralOne (1,016 posts) See mini bio Level 10

@Supreme Marvel: Well it does not matter what either of us believe since we have no knowledge of the viruses origin. Which brings me back to the fact that arguing this would be moot.

I could also care less if you believed they move near light speed or not. I don't believe they can travel long distances at that speed no but as for fighting speed they are inarguably close to it. They move so fast by the end of dbz that the likes of master roshi, who was having a full skirmish in under a second that no human eye could see, was unable to follow. They don't need your belief to show they move fast.

I could care less about how much of reality warpers they are.Janemba has far more powerful shown feats as a reality warper. They have only been shown to move at bare minimum human speeds with the same kind of reactions with a few instances where they show a bit of power over humans and people just as weak as they are. Its no contest that goku would astonish them in a fight. The moment they proclaim their power and he senses the evil intent from lucifer and one shots his host so fast that michael could not even see it, they will retreat. It is just as many people have stated as well. They are only that powerful in their own universe and when brought up against another verse where simply bringing a planet to cataclysm is a minimal threat compared to casual planet busters like freiza, they are nothing. Frieza could also do that same move your fingers and kill a weakling trick. Except he did it to a human of krillins level, who is in no way weak, with complete ease. Yet he could not do it to goku. It is because his power was not so much above his as to where he could do it. The same would go for Lucifer and Michael. They would snap their fingers expecting him to explode and when he disappears and reappears with his whole family to laugh at their fail attempts they will crawl back to their verse in shame.

Post by Haofan123 (3,675 posts) See mini bio Level 13

@Supreme Marvel said:

@Haofan123: Agree there is some ups and downs in the consistency of Supernatural. But there is also loads in DBZ.

Yes Goku was destroyed by a virus. An unknown virus of unknown origin. we dont know how it effected his body and thus saying that a simple finger snap would kill goku is quite ignorant

The virus was cured in the future, it appears to have originated on Earth because Trunks said you would be taken ill by it. Goku never left Earth. So it should be an Earth virus. Meaning he should be able to get other viruses like cancer. During one of the Supernatural episodes, Zachariah I believe gave Dean stage 4 cancer which was killing him quickly. As we saw in episode The Song Remains the Same, Michael is unaffected by time. He appeared to Dean as if the conversation was taken place in Dean's timeline. While Uriel has no idea of who Sam and Dean are.

My point is Michael could possible know this virus, although I don't believe Goku could do anything to a reality warper, and give it to Goku but at a worse stage if he wanted.

I still believe Goku is click away from death.

The DBZverses version of earth is vastly different from our own and the virus was probably unique to it. Even if it wasnt, michael and luci wouldnt know exaclty which virus to use in the first place.

Post by UltimateHero0406 (5,041 posts) See mini bio Level 16

Umm, what is to stop Lucy and Mikey from just taking all The air away or something of That nature.

Post by Haofan123 (3,675 posts) See mini bio Level 13

@UltimateHero0406 said:

Umm, what is to stop Lucy and Mikey from just taking all The air away or something of That nature.

becuase they have never done that before and while they probably could it would be extremely out of character. fucking with people like that is more up zachariahs alley and he usually opts to giving people cancer instead

Post by debeze (222 posts) See mini bio Level 9

cheap hacks are cheap

Post by UltimateHero0406 (5,041 posts) See mini bio Level 16

@Haofan123: If it came down to it, they probably would end up doing something like that if they saw few options left.

Post by Haofan123 (3,675 posts) See mini bio Level 13

@UltimateHero0406 said:

@Haofan123: If it came down to it, they probably would end up doing something like that if they saw few options left.

possbily, cept goku could probably blitz and eliminate them. beisdes teleportation they have only showcased human reaction speed at best

Post by UltimateHero0406 (5,041 posts) See mini bio Level 16

@Haofan123: Blitz and do what? They cannot die. If Goku kills their bodies they will just put them back together and have the element of surprise on top of that. And then, they can cast illusions and Lucy has crazy temptation capabilities. He is essentially overlord of mind boning.

EDIT: And then they can see the future and read minds so I doubt they can be very easily surprised except by Sam and Dean PIS.

Post by Haofan123 (3,675 posts) See mini bio Level 13

@UltimateHero0406 said:

@Haofan123: Blitz and do what? They cannot die. If Goku kills their bodies they will just put them back together and have the element of surprise on top of that. And then, they can cast illusions and Lucy has crazy temptation capabilities. He is essentially overlord of mind boning.

EDIT: And then they can see the future and read minds so I doubt they can be very easily surprised except by Sam and Dean PIS.

Gokus ki attacks can hurt supernatural entities. Hell, in the coming movie not only is he gaining another SSJ form but he is going to fighting a death god. And as I recall lucifer never mindfucked anyone or tempted anyone except for his host who had lost everything. Hell, he even needed sam to be his vessel but he even said himself that he would not tempt sam.

Also, thier mind reading abilities are very obscure. Lucifer and michael arent omniscent and have been caught by surprise several times. Lucifers best instance of this was only being able to tell that sam was going to eventually give up his body but that was all he ever really did

Post by UltimateHero0406 (5,041 posts) See mini bio Level 16

@Haofan123: It still won't kill them. If it ever banished an entity on their level to oblivion, then it would work but I don't remember this. And then even if they were sent some where to die, where? Heaven? Michael is an arch angel who are second only to God in heaven and Lucy owns hell so its not like they are stuck. The special seals only temporarily banish them. They come right back only pissed off. Also, unless I'm behind, isn't Lucy in control of death? So he can't die even if Goku's attacks are enough.

And unless I'm wrong, isn't the movie non canon?

And like I said before, I think the whole thing is heavy PIS. There's no reason near infinitely powerful angels should get outsmarted by regular guys. Similar to how the Flash has been tagged by those a great deal slower than him. It's to make the whole angels vs humans thing a fair fight.

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