Galen Marek vs Battle Angel Alita

Topic started by FalconC2 on Aug. 13, 2014. Last post by Dream 1 month ago.
Post by FalconC2 (377 posts) See mini bio Level 9

Galen Marek and...

...Alita face off.

So yeah, they are both in their prime. No real restrictions. They are both here to kill each other and have nothing holding them back on that.

Post by ReiKai (3,517 posts) See mini bio Level 10
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Alita takes his face off. Then puts it on'er boot and proceeds to stomp his face into his balls.
Post by FalconC2 (377 posts) See mini bio Level 9

How exactly? Galen Marek could just crush her before she could any of that and if he get her brain chip it's all over for her. Not to mention his force lightning should be powerful enough to power this.

13:00+

You know on top of being capable of disintegrating things with the force, and altering the trajectory of star destroyers falling from orbit. You know, I like that HK-47 talks about how extremely difficult it is to kill force users, that gas is generally ineffective against them, that only heavy ordnance and explosives at close range could do the trick, and that people had to be taught how to defend against their mind tricks by Revan a Sith Lord because they were helpless without him. Oh, and that any planning is useless as well because of their precognition.

By the way, before you say they don't have superspeed because I know you will do remember that force speed is a thing. That slug-throwers are hypersonic and they are woefully inadequate compared to blasters which are more advanced in every way. Same blasters powerful forcers like making a mockery of.

Post by EVA_01 (179 posts) See mini bio Level 9

@FalconC2: What's the point of making a battle thread where you already have an excess winner in mind?

Post by FalconC2 (377 posts) See mini bio Level 9

@EVA_01: Oh, I don't have a winner in mind I am just bring up some of Galen's feats and what he can do. I want to see if someone can actually back up their claims with something tangible that isn't seeped is anything approaching a bias.

That's why I asked "how exactly" and didn't say "Galen would win this regardless."

Post by EVA_01 (179 posts) See mini bio Level 9

@FalconC2: Oh I see.

on the battle though I really can't see alita winning this, for reasons already stated.

Post by FalconC2 (377 posts) See mini bio Level 9

I remember Alita being pretty fast. Much, much weaker characters than her are supersonic.

Also, has some good regeneration and unless her brain chip is destroyed she will just heal the damage. A few ranged attacks could help her here but Alita is heavy on the melee.

Post by FalconC2 (377 posts) See mini bio Level 9

I think she has a laser or something but how powerful is that?

Post by EVA_01 (179 posts) See mini bio Level 9

@FalconC2: She did? It's been ages since I watched it; I know she's pretty fast, but I don't remember her destructive capacity being anything impressive (unless I'm missing something)

Post by FalconC2 (377 posts) See mini bio Level 9

It was in the Last Order manga IIRC. That's where more of her impressive feats are and where she gets a few new bodies. Zekka was pretty badass in it.

Post by hitsusatsu11 (10,747 posts) See mini bio Level 20

Battle Angels got this.

Post by SpeedForceSpider (4,962 posts) See mini bio Level 15

Is this Galen or the Starkiller clone? The clone should stomp.

Post by takashichea (12,417 posts) See mini bio Level 25
Moderator

@FalconC2:

You need images in your OP. Otherwise, I have to lock in 24 hours.

Also, pay attention to SpeedForceSpider's comment:

@SpeedForceSpider said:

Is this Galen or the Starkiller clone? The clone should stomp.

You have to be specific if necessary with your characters in the future especially comic book characters or any other medium.

Post by FalconC2 (377 posts) See mini bio Level 9

@SpeedForceSpider: The original, though there shouldn't be much of a difference as the only reason the clone is so powerful is because he has some of the original's memory and aptitude towards the force.

Post by FalconC2 (377 posts) See mini bio Level 9

Also, I would argue that is original is stronger based on the fact he could hold off Darth Sidious for a while. As well as having less trouble with Darth Vader in his final confrontation with his former master than his clone did.

Post by ReiKai (3,517 posts) See mini bio Level 10
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@FalconC2: Force Crush requires Focus and, more importantly, to see the target. FC against a Sentient being has never been performed because they naturally resist influence over their bodies. Hence the most any Force user has ever done is a Force Choke. Which is completely ineffective against Alita. Alita has full control over her body, which is a living machine with Imaginos 2.1+ and she's impervious to mental effects and attacks.
 
In terms of speed, she was low hypersonic in her Tuned body. Imaginos 1.0 she was high hyper-sonic, and 2.0 she's over Mach50 and, under specific conditions, can even achieve superluminal speeds. Alita also has mind tricks of her own and can manipulate her opponents mind with Mental Emptiness, and she can project her Intent as illusions to create Astral Doppelgangers. Ultimately Alita is already so fast that she can separate Galen's head and limbs from his body before the Force can tell him how boned he is.
Post by FalconC2 (377 posts) See mini bio Level 9

@ReiKai: Force Crush requires Focus and, more importantly, to see the target.

No, not really it's something that can be done easily and at the drop of the hat. As take for example this instance.

Or, with Darth Vader here where it also required almost no focus.

At approximately 1:38+ we see him do it with ease.

FC against a Sentient being has never been performed because they naturally resist influence over their bodies.

What I just showed you several instances where force choke was done to sentient beings and that it actually worked. Are you messing with me or something. Anyone with even a passing knowledge of Star Wars knows that force choke can be used on people.

Hence the most any Force user has ever done is a Force Choke. Which is completely ineffective against Alita. Alita has full control over her body, which is a living machine with Imaginos 2.1+ and she's impervious to mental effects and attacks.

What are these generalizations you are coming to coming from? Also, you should try telling that to all those storm troopers who got viciously murder by it. You do remember that even Galen Marek's clone could disintegrate hoards of them with it? Yeah, that is some resistance they got. I am pretty resistant to fire too just ignore the fact that it can horribly kill me.

In terms of speed, she was low hypersonic in her Tuned body. Imaginos 1.0 she was high hyper-sonic, and 2.0 she's over Mach50 and, under specific conditions, can even achieve superluminal speeds.

Do you have calculations to actually prove all of that or are just pulling random numbers out of nowhere? You are going to need heavy proof to prove that Alita is actually FTL and I do mean that with an emphasis on heavy because I don't what you are talking about you say that.

Amway, I am going to quote Darth Wong from SD.net about force speed. This is the relevant link.

http://bbs.stardestroyer.net/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=9697&start=50

All right, I'll call your little bluff, asshole. The one thing I hate worse than someone who plays games in a debate is someone who outright lies about the facts, and by claiming that you've inspected this scene and seen no Force-speed, you're lying. I digitized the sequence, did an inverse-telecine with VirtualDub to convert back to the original theatrical frame rate, and dumped to image sequence. Read 'em and weep, bullshitter:

Time: 0 seconds. This is before they start.

Time: 0.04 seconds. They initiate Force-speed. Notice how they've become transclucent. You can actually see the door right through Qui-Gon.

Time: 0.08 seconds. It's hard to see because they're translucent in Force-speed, but judging by Obi-Wan's saber, he's covered roughly 1 metre. To accelerate from standing start to cover 1 metre in 0.04 seconds requires acceleration of 1250 m/s^2, or more than one hundred fucking G's at a minimum. Even if the location of his sabre is misleading and he only covered 1/2 metre in that time, he would still need to accelerate at more than 60 G's.

Time: 0.12 seconds. Obi-Wan has covered another metre, which indicates that he's topped out at around 20-30 m/s (45-68 mph). That's fucking automobile highway speed, pal. And we're not just talking about moving his arm or bending his hips; we're talking about accelerating his entire body.

Time: 0.21 seconds. Notice how Qui-Gon is quite obviously transclucent in this scene; he is only visible as a shadow. Obi-Wan is almost completely invisible; if it weren't for his sabre, you wouldn't even know he's there. Now we know the ANH novelization wasn't exaggerating when it said he could become wraith-like.

The bold is what is important as they have an acceleration of 1250 m/s^2 meaning that both Obiwan and Qui Gon Jinn could reach high supersonic speeds if only given a whole second. That's how ridiculous their acceleration is.

Galen Marek is obviously above the both of them in terms of power and skill.

Alita also has mind tricks of her own and can manipulate her opponents mind with Mental Emptiness, and she can project her Intent as illusions to create Astral Doppelgangers.

The latter worked against Caerula Sanguis whose power was not precognition it was a form of prediction of an opponent's moves kind of like what the Midnighter does. They assess all possible moves an opponent could make and counter the most likely action. Which is why Alita's split intent worked. Force precognition on the other is not about reading an opponents future moves by analyzing their behavior and intent. It's about literally sensing the future like with Spiderman's spider sense.

Ultimately Alita is already so fast that she can separate Galen's head and limbs from his body before the Force can tell him how boned he is.

Which you have neglected to provide any actual evidence for other than "this person is that impressive because I say so." I wanted answers not seeped in bias and the only thing you brought up was this:

Which you have neglected to actually apply any context for as from my position it just looks faster than eye and some after-images unless you want to apply some calculation to it. It better make sense though.

Post by ReiKai (3,517 posts) See mini bio Level 10
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@FalconC2:

No, not really it's something that can be done easily and at the drop of the hat. As take for example this instance.

That's Force Choke, not Force Crush. And again, requires Seeing the target. A live connection via Holo still makes a Visual Connection. It has nothing to do with range, only with what the Force user can See. Much of that is explained by HK-47 in how to kill them and how their abilities tend to function.

At approximately 1:38+ we see him do it with ease.

Yes and he was Looking at him the whole time he he was doing Force Choke. Which is, again, a completely Separate ability from Force Crush. Obi-Wan demonstrates Force Crush against two Battle Droids.

But even that's not impressive. Regular Clone Troopers can run up, tear their heads off and beat them down with bare hands if necessary.

What I just showed you several instances where force choke was done to sentient beings and that it actually worked. Are you messing with me or something. Anyone with even a passing knowledge of Star Wars knows that force choke can be used on people.

Again, two different abilities. And Vader used it on people not expecting it and had no ability in the Force at all. It's still not the same as Force Crush, and even that's never been done against anything larger than a Human. Also, showing us what Vader can do isn't the same a showing what Galen Marek can do. While Alita doesn't use "The Force", she has electromagnetic powers and control, as well as the ability to generate and manipulate plasma. She can also sense ki.

What are these generalizations you are coming to coming from? Also, you should try telling that to all those storm troopers who got viciously murder by it. You do remember that even Galen Marek's clone could disintegrate hoards of them with it? Yeah, that is some resistance they got. I am pretty resistant to fire too just ignore the fact that it can horribly kill me.

Again you're completely mixing up abilities. Galen did not "disintegrate" Troopers with Force Crush. That's Force Wave, and that's something that he only ever did in the Trailers. Galen never disintegrated people with the Force in the novelizations or in cut scenes within the games themselves. I know cause I have both novels. Read them cover to cover and they remove a lot of the fluff from the games.

Do you have calculations to actually prove all of that or are just pulling random numbers out of nowhere? You are going to need heavy proof to prove that Alita is actually FTL and I do mean that with an emphasis on heavy because I don't what you are talking about you say that.

Unlike the majority of SW fans, I actually have evidence and proof and not pointless and horrible speculation.

Also, never said Alita was FTL. Superluminal is more like sublight and closer to lightspeed. And as I said, it required specific conditions to be met.

Toji had done something similar before in an earlier match, but again requires very specific conditions to perform.

The bold is what is important as they have an acceleration of 1250 m/s^2 meaning that both Obiwan and Qui Gon Jinn could reach high supersonic speeds if only given a whole second. That's how ridiculous their acceleration is.

I should point out that he is BS'ing out his ass. That's not acceleration. That's the editing team switching from Live to Green Screened CGI footage of them using Force Speed. It's just the transition from the Live Feed to the CGI. Also, his math is complete BS as well. To go a distance of 1meter in 0.04sec is a speed of 25m/s. You know how fast that is? 55.9mph. That's it. This is using an actual Calculator. This is why SW fans need to go back to school. They need to stop inventing numbers and learn how to do Math properly. And Star Wars writers need to do the same and learn actual Physics.

The latter worked against Caerula Sanguis whose power was not precognition it was a form of prediction of an opponent's moves kind of like what the Midnighter does. They assess all possible moves an opponent could make and counter the most likely action. Which is why Alita's split intent worked. Force precognition on the other is not about reading an opponents future moves by analyzing their behavior and intent. It's about literally sensing the future like with Spiderman's spider sense.

It only worked against Caerula all of once because the first time it was unexpected. Also, you're wrong about how Force Precog works. It is almost entirely about Intent. And it can be tricked rather easily, as explained in the HK-47 video. Peter's Spider-Sense is completely different, and even that can be tricked.

Which you have neglected to actually apply any context for as from my position it just looks faster than eye and some after-images unless you want to apply some calculation to it. It better make sense though.

As shown, Alita in a damaged Tuned body was hypersonic. In Imaginos1.0 against Caerula she's even faster.

And in Imaginos 2.0 she exceeds all limits. She literally performs brain surgery to counteract tens of thousands of waves rebounding within Zazie's skull at Mach5+speeds, and had to create a counter-wave for each and every one of them within nary an instant to save her.

At minimum she counters 20thousand invisible, microscopic particles in Zazie's head that move in excess of Mach5 (Hypersonic Speed) and does so within a second or two. Sechs only job is to keep the vibrations from this from destroying the bedframe. This really doesn't require more of an explanation. But I'll say a bit more anyway. The average adult skull is 8.2in long and 6.9in wide. A cranial capacity of about 990ccm's (Cubic Centimeters). It would take an object moving at 55mph 0.15sec to move a distance of 8.2in. An object moving at Mach 1 would take 0.0107sec. More than 10x faster. Mach 5, 0.00215sec.

The soliton waves were moving in excess of Mach 5. So in less than 1/500th of a second, each of them was bounding randomly around inside Zazie's head. And in faster than 1/10000th of a second, Alita was countering them. That's 20x Faster. That would actually place her reaction and striking speed at Mach 100. And that's at the very least.

MOD EDIT

Remove Scans that have Pirated Watermarks

Post by SpeedForceSpider (4,962 posts) See mini bio Level 15

@FalconC2 said:

Also, I would argue that is original is stronger based on the fact he could hold off Darth Sidious for a while. As well as having less trouble with Darth Vader in his final confrontation with his former master than his clone did.

Actually, the Clone has feats like steering a falling ship with TK as it was breaking up in the atmosphere. That is better than anything the Galen has done. Also, in the dark side ending of FU 1, Sidious fodderized Galen with a simple gesture. The original did no such thing as "hold his own" against him. In the FU novelization Galen says something like "it's a trick! he is stronger than you know!" so it's obvious he wasn't holding his own.

Vader was also weaker and slower in the first game. He had several modifications for his suit including the ability withstand force lightning and the original Starkiller's was pretty weak.

As for this battle, I am going to say Alita wins.

Post by FalconC2 (377 posts) See mini bio Level 9

@SpeedForceSpider:

Actually, the Clone has feats like steering a falling ship with TK as it was breaking up in the atmosphere.

You are forgetting that the original Galen Marek also slowed down and altered the course of the star destroyer that fell from orbit on foot in both the novel and comic.

That is better than anything the Galen has done. Also, in the dark side ending of FU 1, Sidious fodderized Galen with a simple gesture.

The dark side was non-canon and the Force Unleashed II follows up on the light side ending. During the light siding ending Galen Marek is able to hold off Darth Sidious long enough for the rebels to escape and dies for it. You remember? Do also remember that the dark side ending leaded to Luke Skywalker joining Galen Marek as his apprentice. That's a complete contradiction of canon.

The original did no such thing as "hold his own" against him.

You are forgetting the part where Galen Marek is able to hold off Darth Sidious enough for the rebels to escape. Also, I did not say hold his own I said hold off there's a difference.

In the FU novelization Galen says something like "it's a trick! he is stronger than you know!" so it's obvious he wasn't holding his own.

Yes, but that was when Darth Sidious was trying to turn him to the dark side. When that failed he tried to kill Galen Marek and the rebels but Galen Marek managed to save them with his sacrifice.

Also, it wasn't "it's a trick! he is stronger than you know!" it was more along the lines of some inner monologue on how powerful Darth Sidious was.

Vader was also weaker and slower in the first game. He had several modifications for his suit including the ability withstand force lightning

No, Darth Vader had no such mentioned modifications and he was not weaker and slower. He was just the same. I do not recall these modifications that you are talking about.

and the original Starkiller's was pretty weak.

We are talking about the same force lightning that could match Darth Sidious's long enough to save the rebels from his wrath? No, it wasn't weak at all.

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