Dante vs Raoh

Topic started by DoctorUniverse on Nov. 17, 2012. Last post by phantomrant 1 year, 10 months ago.
Post by DoctorUniverse (14 posts) See mini bio Level 4

Winner by death, KO, surrender.

Both start off twenty feet apart.

Fight takes place in a ruined city.

Post by Kurohige (3,718 posts) See mini bio Level 19

Dante gets wrecked, especially if this is the one from the anime (Going by the picture) he has nothing on Musou Tensei and his regen wont be able to keep him alive from the kind of damage Raoh can dish out, the guy punched a giant building in half from the sheer force of his punch from quite a distance away, not to mention being hypersonic+ in speed. He also has precognition and beats Dante in just about every stat except stamina and regeneration, not that it really matters. Now if the is DMC 2 or 4 Dante it would be a completely different story.

Post by SpeedForceSpider (4,949 posts) See mini bio Level 15

@Kurohige: Dude, Dante was massively hypersonic in DMC 1. With the right weapons he stomps.

Post by Kurohige (3,718 posts) See mini bio Level 19

@SpeedForceSpider: That's true, depending on what weapons, I was just going off of the anime version though. I think I underestimated the guy. But from the picture I dunno if that Dante will do much. Musou Tensei will be hard enough.

Post by SpeedForceSpider (4,949 posts) See mini bio Level 15

@Kurohige: Okay I agree if its how he was in the anime with just Rebellion he loses. If he has access to weapons like Alastor or he gets Sparda he wins. But wait a minute, can't the guy get shot to death by Ebony and Ivory? In DMC he showed the ability to charge his weapons with a high level of his demonic energy.

Post by Fehafare (9,333 posts) See mini bio Level 13

I see the Alastor bullshit is still going on.

Post by DoctorUniverse (14 posts) See mini bio Level 4

@SpeedForceSpider said:

@Kurohige: Dude, Dante was massively hypersonic in DMC 1. With the right weapons he stomps.

True, but most characters in Fist of the North Star are Hypersonic as well.

Post by SpeedForceSpider (4,949 posts) See mini bio Level 15

@Fehafare said:

I see the Alastor bullshit is still going on.

You can't even disprove the Alastor lightning speed to this day.

@DoctorUniverse: Dante is a time stopper as well he has too many powers at his disposal.

Post by Fehafare (9,333 posts) See mini bio Level 13

@SpeedForceSpider: What?

A statement/tool tip of a weapon is not valid in any way, shape or form, which is pretty much the only thing suggestion lightning-speed for Alastor.

Post by SpeedForceSpider (4,949 posts) See mini bio Level 15

@Fehafare: How about the cutscene? The point of the cutscene was to show Dante's speed with it. The glass slowed down and dropped after he was done. I don't know why you feel the need to disprove and complain about it. Now I gave you another suggestion now try to disprove that as well.

Post by ReiKai (3,516 posts) See mini bio Level 10
Let me point out, for one, that the DMC anime is not a separate continuity. It's all canon with the games, including the Manga and Novelizations. The only non-canon thing in DMC is the 5th one. Also, Hokuto Shinken chars didn't start hitting hypersonic till towards the end of the series. Much of the early guys weren't even sonic speed. Didn't come until a bit later. Only person who had been at that point was Kenshiro.
 
Now, those under the idea that Dante can't hurt Raoh because of Musou Tensei are, well...misinformed. MT users could still be hurt, generally by others, but still used chi. Normal attacks couldn't hurt them. What we have here is a guy who deals with the abnormal every morning. Dante has a magic, near-indestructible demonic sword and a number of powers at his disposal, including elemental based powers. He kills demons that normal human weapons won't affect. Dante's guns are anything but normal and he creates the bullets with his own demonic energy. It's why he never has to reload.
 
On a side note, Dante took out Abigail/Cid who could summon demons en-masse, as well as toss around multi-block leveling attacks. Abigail, supposedly, had power on par with that of Mundus. At the time, Dante required powered borrowed from the Sparda sword in order to defeat Mundus. Years later with the DMC anime, it is apparent Dante's personal power has grown to such a point that he no longer needs the Sparda Sword to defeat a demon of that level, and in fact didn't even seem to require using his Devil Trigger to transform. During the end of the fight with Abigail, it was suggested he may have transformed, but was never shown. More likely he just used more of his power.
Post by Fehafare (9,333 posts) See mini bio Level 13

@SpeedForceSpider: So you are basing your argument off of a scene in which shit is happening in slow-motion to make the outrageous claim of lightning speed? People tried to calc that scene and either failed completely or never finished nor was it ever reviewed or approved by a group of trustworthy people with experience, "experts" if you want to call them to even make it valid. And that scene went through non of that, making it absolutely unquantifiable as it is not self evident like some other scenes for feats. In other words, it proves jack shit.

Post by SpeedForceSpider (4,949 posts) See mini bio Level 15

@ReiKai said:

Let me point out, for one, that the DMC anime is not a separate continuity. It's all canon with the games, including the Manga and Novelizations. The only non-canon thing in DMC is the 5th one. Also, Hokuto Shinken chars didn't start hitting hypersonic till towards the end of the series. Much of the early guys weren't even sonic speed. Didn't come until a bit later. Only person who had been at that point was Kenshiro. Now, those under the idea that Dante can't hurt Raoh because of Musou Tensei are, well...misinformed. MT users could still be hurt, generally by others, but still used chi. Normal attacks couldn't hurt them. What we have here is a guy who deals with the abnormal every morning. Dante has a magic, near-indestructible demonic sword and a number of powers at his disposal, including elemental based powers. He kills demons that normal human weapons won't affect. Dante's guns are anything but normal and he creates the bullets with his own demonic energy. It's why he never has to reload. On a side note, Dante took out Abigail/Cid who could summon demons en-masse, as well as toss around multi-block leveling attacks. Abigail, supposedly, had power on par with that of Mundus. At the time, Dante required powered borrowed from the Sparda sword in order to defeat Mundus. Years later with the DMC anime, it is apparent Dante's personal power has grown to such a point that he no longer needs the Sparda Sword to defeat a demon of that level, and in fact didn't even seem to require using his Devil Trigger to transform. During the end of the fight with Abigail, it was suggested he may have transformed, but was never shown. More likely he just used more of his power.

Finally someone with sense.

@Fehafare: Honestly I don't give a flying f*ck about those people or their calcs. Scan or videos are the best way to settle a debate. If you don't wanna believe it that is fine, but since you have no way in disproving my argument other than your opinion it shouldn't matter to you this much.

Post by ReiKai (3,516 posts) See mini bio Level 10
Let us avoid further argument with a scene in DMC1 as it is older and graphics design then was lacking a bit. Try more DMC3 with the Tower Dive.
  
  If you'll take note, Rebellion glows red hot after it's shot and still streaking straight downwards. The friction in the air caused by its descent creates heat, which occurs after exceeding a certain degree of speed and is what we see when an object makes reentry into the planets atmosphere. Here we're looking at the high-hypersonic range. And we see that Dante, while controlling his descent via running alongside the tower, has managed to move fast enough to catch his sword, even after throwing it ahead of himself and shooting it.
Post by Fehafare (9,333 posts) See mini bio Level 13

@ReiKai: That scene was calced and it is between mach 7 and 9. Way more impressive is the raindrop feat which is set at mach 15, but some people disagree with it because it was not an actual cutscence in the game.

@SpeedForceSpider:

Again, that video proves nothing without a clac. You are pretty much saying, "So he swings his sword around in slow motion a few time, that obviously means he is lightning speed even tho i have absolutely no proof what-so-ever for this claim." I'm now just gonna say that that video displays no more than peak human speed, please disprove me?

You are constantly saying "your opinion". It has jack shit to do with my opinion it's simply how feats are taken on a debating scale on most forums.

Post by ReiKai (3,516 posts) See mini bio Level 10
The raindrop thing is a cutscene. It's a mid-battle cutscene. Was also first indicated in the DMC3 opening scene. Also, because of the shape of the cone on the sword and the heating, those're indications of speeds around and above Mach 10. I go with the visual indicators as opposed to the way the background was moving.
Post by SpeedForceSpider (4,949 posts) See mini bio Level 15

@Fehafare: Ah, good to know.

Post by Fehafare (9,333 posts) See mini bio Level 13

@ReiKai: It was the sword and Dante being calced and not the moving of the background or anything.

The scene does not appear in mid game i think (can't remember it's a while back i played DMC3) and people mostly refuse it because it only appeared in the opening.

Post by SpeedForceSpider (4,949 posts) See mini bio Level 15

@Fehafare: That scene happened after Vergil stabbed him and his powers awakened. So it was not the opening smh that happened after what 3 bosses prior.

Post by Kurohige (3,718 posts) See mini bio Level 19

@ReiKai said:

Let me point out, for one, that the DMC anime is not a separate continuity. It's all canon with the games, including the Manga and Novelizations.

Where did you hear that? He barley should any capabilities that he did from the game in the anime. Where are you getting that it is canon?

Also, Hokuto Shinken chars didn't start hitting hypersonic till towards the end of the series. Much of the early guys weren't even sonic speed. Didn't come until a bit later.

Gonna call BS on that, Rei was already fighting toe to toe with Kenshiro at the beginning of the series and even tagging Kenshiro on many occasions and were pretty much equal for a while. Shin was already able to easily catch a guy's hands who moved so fast they turned invisible and could slash through steel. Uigher(Or however you spell it) was already cracking his whips faster than sonic speed which Kenshiro easily caught and made a bow with and deflected before the guy even noticed. Even Jagi was able to move pretty fast, Kenshiro just knew how predictable he and his fighting style, In the Jagi Gaiden the guy used the Thousand Hand Slaughter in took out multiple guys at once before they even knew what happened, and that was pre-series, not to mention Raoh was above all these guys until the end of series 1 where he even beat Kenshiro in one incarnation. Unless you mean the random fodder or MAYBE Devil. I don't know where you got half the cast not even being sonic speed. Hell even Spade appeared to be teleporting when he moved and he was just a lacky.

Now, those under the idea that Dante can't hurt Raoh because of Musou Tensei are, well...misinformed. MT users could still be hurt, generally by others, but still used chi.

Don't know where that was from, I'm pretty sure Musou Tensei can only be countered by Musou Tensei or at least someone whith vast knowledge on the Technique such as Kaioh. Where has Dante even touched something intangible, let alone something that would instantly kill him the moment he does. And for the record, Kaioh fired a chi blast at Kenshiro while in Musous Tensei and it went right through him

Normal attacks couldn't hurt them. What we have here is a guy who deals with the abnormal every morning.

Yeah, so does Kenshiro.

Dante has a magic, near-indestructible demonic sword and a number of powers at his disposal, including elemental based powers. He kills demons that normal human weapons won't affect. Dante's guns are anything but normal and he creates the bullets with his own demonic energy. It's why he never has to reload.

None of this explained why you think Dante could hit Raoh in Musou Tensei. And while Dante has that, Raoh has precog, chi manipulation, a vast array of versatile Hokuto moves and most of which are instant death. He has ki shields, flight and he has Hokuto moves in which come out in the form of ki and still blow you up regardless of if you block it or not (As seen when he killed Kiba while in his steel armor) In case you forgot, It doesn't matter if his bullets are normal or not, all they have shown is that they are stronger than normal bullets and even so they are meant to kill demons. Their speed should be the same which Raoh can easily see coming and dodge. By normal human weapons you mean pistols and semi-automatics?

On a side note, Dante took out Abigail/Cid who could summon demons en-masse, as well as toss around multi-block leveling attacks.Abigail, supposedly, had power on par with that of Mundus.

And Raoh took on Kenshiro whom in their battle was demolishing the city and changing the weather. Raoh took on masses too, and didn't Dante have Lady and Trish helping him with that? lol. Not to mention different people with different ability; Raoh doesn't need to have multi-city block level attacks, he simply needs to touch Dante. Not to mention him punching a large building in half from the sheer force of his punch from several hundred meters away, and that was pre-series. Sid demolishing that city block was due to just his size really and even the guy was able to stab Dante, only because he got cocky and thought he was dead did it give him a chance to finish him off. Aside from summoning it was nothing too impressive and again that guy was far slower than Raoh with a vastly lower array of attacks so I don't see hwo that helps Dante's case.

At the time, Dante required powered borrowed from the Sparda sword in order to defeat Mundus. Years later with the DMC anime, it is apparent Dante's personal power has grown to such a point that he no longer needs the Sparda Sword to defeat a demon of that level, and in fact didn't even seem to require using his Devil Trigger to transform.

Okay, but you're just telling me how Dante took on they really big guys, you are not telling me how he is going to win this battle, by charging in with his sword like he did in that fight? Roah has precog and would see that coming and simply take him out with one of the hundred of insta-kills that he has.

During the end of the fight with Abigail, it was suggested he may have transformed, but was never shown. More likely he just used more of his power.

Doesn't really matter either way. Most of his normal attacks were hurting him anyway and he broke out of his spikes with pure strength so it's not impressive either way.

Dante has no way of getting past Musou Tensei, precog, instant death by a simple touch or long range ki, Raoh's aura shield, his flight, speed, and raw power that can even be used from yards away. Maybe if Dante had things like quicksilver or something he would win or even DMC 2 or 4 Dante. But I don't see how he wins.

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