Watch & Learn: Death Note Episode #24

Topic started by No_name_here on June 20, 2010. Last post by ZachTheAnimeGeek 4 years ago.
Post by No_name_here (854 posts) See mini bio Level 11
Staff

 Those symbols might as well be saying "Sucker."
 Those symbols might as well be saying "Sucker."

Ha! I guess I can go back to totally hating Light again. It’s quite incredible how this show’s able to lull you into a false sense of security (and security, for that matter.) Over the last arc with Higuchi (which I presume was a manga volume,) I got used to Light, L, Misa and the rest of the task force working together like a big happy family, but now…   that red-haired bastard Kira’s back. And what better way to show he’s back than revealing how he’s a cheater on top of everything.  That whole flashback of his deal with Ryuk and Rem was frustrating. They just made up those new rules?! Ack! I hope it turns out that whatever “old man”  in the Shinigami realm that Ryuk’s referring turns out to NOT be OK with that.

 He's basically been glued to the screens since Aizawa left, anyway.
 He's basically been glued to the screens since Aizawa left, anyway.

L definitely suspects what’s going on, though. You can just tell from the way he’s watching the security feed. Light can hide things from him, sure, but Misa’s horrible at it.

Actually, the characters rag on Matsuda for being stupid, but she is just hopeless. The way they’ve shown different characters' approaches to using the death note bluntly reinforce that Light’s the only pro when it comes to shinigami power (as if there could be one.)  He knew well enough that it was a awful idea to make the eyes deal… but her? She’s not thinking it through, at all.

Let’s break down the math…

On average, Misa would probably live to be 80 years old. If she’s 20, now, that means she’d only live to be 50. Well, she would’ve if she only made the deal once. But she made it twice, halving that half so she’s not only got a fourth of her life span remaining.  Now, she’ll only live to be 35. She just shaved 45 years off her life for a guy who can’t stand her. I suppose that’s a metaphor for bad relationships, right? The real visual metaphor for all of this is that scene where she meets with Ryuk. Light knows to give Ryuk an shiny apple to bribe him; Misa agrees to bite into the Shinigami apple,  even when it doesn’t look good, and then acts surprised when it tastes like sand. What did she expect?

You can watch this episode, “Revival,” for yourself on Hulu here, and read my comments about the previous episode here.

-- Tom Pinchuk is the writer of UNIMAGINABLE for Arcana Studios and HYBRID BASTARDS! for Archaia. HYBRID BASTARDS! is available  here and UNIMAGINABLE is available here for pre-order on Amazon.com.  

Post by Roy42 (6 posts) See mini bio Level 7
I must admit, this whole arc just tossed my predictions and feelings back and forth like a ragdoll. And I loved every minute of it. Just wait, Tom; unless you've already watched the episode already and just have to write the article, #25 is…episode 25. I can't and won't say anything. I've only just watched that one episode myself (I'm just watching one or two eps ahead of you at the moment) and my mind is fully reeling. 
 
Also, if you're located outside the U.S, as I am, you can watch Death Note episodes on OnePieceOfBleach.com, since Hulu is stupid about that sort of thing.
Post by sotyfan16 (1,340 posts) See mini bio Level 20

This episode seemed to carry on as my heart rate slowed because of pure genious awesomeness of Light. If you are surprised that Misa made the 'eye deal' for the second time then just wait and see what she does through the rest of the series. And putting fake rules is a wonderful way to through every reasonable idea about the Death Note out the window. Everything is coming to a head as a very memorable moment is upon us.

Post by FoxxFireArt (2,638 posts) See mini bio Level 25
Moderator
Well, it's not as if you can be shocked that Light would cheat. It's not as if he's above that.
 
I'm glad you mentioned the absurdity that Misa would make the eye deal twice. This just further supports my notion that Misa is the Harley Quinn of Death Note.
You were also using optimum calculations of human life expectancy. What if she was originally going to die at 70 or less. After this deal, as far as she knows, she could be down to months. Those in celebrity positions are often prone to early deaths.
 
In my mind. I can't see how someone could "root" for such a despicable psychopath who kills innocents, law enforcement, and is generally manipulative and abusive to women. This stuff is why I see Light lovers of having some serious issues with women. I know that sounds harsh, but this stuff is just sadistic.
When I watch what he does with women. I hate him all the more. He knows Misa loves him and is completely devoted to him, but to Light she's an annoying pest and a tool to be used.
 
This kind of brings up a topic that I've always wondered about this series. If your cut your life span in half for the Shinigami Eyes. What happens to you when your life clock hits zero? Do you have a heart attack, drop down dead, suicide, or will it just accelerate what was going to be your original cause of death?
Post by OnlyWonderBoy (16 posts) See mini bio Level 4
@FoxxFireArt said:

I can't see how someone could "root" for such a despicable psychopath who kills innocents, law enforcement, and is generally manipulative and abusive to women.

At least for me the answer to that is quite simple, watching Light do his thing was half of what made the show so appealing. The other half is L investigating the case. But if you take that into account, then L can't be interesting without Light being a worthy advisory. In the end, Light is just a fictional character so i was able to absorb his actions and appreciate the intelligence and finesse it took to do what he did without without feeling too bad because in the end it's just a show. Now if this were to take place in real life I would be whole heartedly against Kira. Sometimes the best way to enjoy things is to step back and realize it isn't real life after all.    
Post by sickVisionz (4,221 posts) See mini bio Level 24
Moderator
Come on Tom, you're just now realizing that Misa is an idiot?
 
When this episode and the prior one aired, I remember being really happy that the Light & L: Best Friends Forever!! sitcom had finally ended and Light was back to his old self. 
 
@FoxxFireArt:
Rooting for Light isn't that crazy imo.  He's the most interesting character in the series and it's no different than rooting for Tony in Scarface, Michael in the Godfather and the countless other class mob bosses or drug dealers we've seen on the silver screen.  You latch on to his positive traits and ignore or justify the negative ones. 

I have a hard time feeling sorry for Misa because: 
  1. She's a complete idiot
  2. She actually wants to be used as a tool and thinks that being a tool is the most awesomestest bestest thing in the world.
  3. She's no innocent victim herself.  She's killed people on her own accord as well.
 
All of the women that Light hooks up with have some sort of deep psychological issues that make it hard for me to feel sorry for them.  Light is a murderous psycho and all of them know this yet they still want to be with him.  It's not like he switches up and turns evil on them.  They're attracted to him because he's evil.  They want to be used by him.  They're getting exactly what they want from the relationship.
Post by FoxxFireArt (2,638 posts) See mini bio Level 25
Moderator
@OnlyWonderBoy: 
I bring up the issue, because people aren't saying they are caught up in the story or writing. They are using terms like "rooting for" for whole way. That watching him torment that innocent woman from earlier on in the series made them "happy". Knowing full well that this innocent woman who is out seeking justice for her lover is going to be killed.
 
From a psychological standpoint I get curious of someone who can watch a horrible act on an innocent person and make them feel happy. Just saying it's fiction seems more like an excuse.
Is it alright to get pleasure out of watching horrible acts just as long as they are in a sense fictional?
 
@sickVisionz:
Misa has more justification then Light ever did. Her parents were murdered and the justice system was going to let the killer free. She actually suffered something in life. I don't say that to excuse her murdering police. She just has more reason to want criminals to pay then Light ever did.
 
Also, because she's an idiot she somehow deserves it??
Post by sickVisionz (4,221 posts) See mini bio Level 24
Moderator
@FoxxFireArt: Her being an idiot is one of three reasons why I don't feel sorry for her.  It's not like Light is running some long and complex con on her.  It's pretty obvious.  She's either too stupid to realize it or she wants it to happen, both of which don't win her pity points in my book.
Post by BigChief (9 posts) See mini bio Level 10
@OnlyWonderBoy said:
" @FoxxFireArt said:

I can't see how someone could "root" for such a despicable psychopath who kills innocents, law enforcement, and is generally manipulative and abusive to women.

At least for me the answer to that is quite simple, watching Light do his thing was half of what made the show so appealing. The other half is L investigating the case. But if you take that into account, then L can't be interesting without Light being a worthy advisory. In the end, Light is just a fictional character so i was able to absorb his actions and appreciate the intelligence and finesse it took to do what he did without without feeling too bad because in the end it's just a show. Now if this were to take place in real life I would be whole heartedly against Kira. Sometimes the best way to enjoy things is to step back and realize it isn't real life after all.     "
You're not entirely wrong there, and I'll grant you that Light is at least an interesting character, and that he's basically the driving force for the entire series. However, I have a hard time rooting for characters that I don't find relatable or sympathetic. And I don't find Light to be either of those.
Post by FoxxFireArt (2,638 posts) See mini bio Level 25
Moderator
@sickVisionz said:
" @FoxxFireArt: Her being an idiot is one of three reasons why I don't feel sorry for her.  It's not like Light is running some long and complex con on her.  It's pretty obvious.  She's either too stupid to realize it or she wants it to happen, both of which don't win her pity points in my book. "
Isn't that in itself weird though? It's because she's not very smart that she's so easily manipulated. She's blinded by love or undeserved devotion. It's that fact that makes me feel a little sorry for her. It's kind of like watching a friend of yours be so devoted to a guy that you know treats her like crap.
 
How is Light not running some long and complex con on Misa? He's running a con on everyone. He's asking her this time to half her life again to serve him. That's rather long term. 
 
@BigChief said:
" I have a hard time rooting for characters that I don't find relatable or sympathetic. And I don't find Light to be either of those. "
I'm not denying that Light is an interesting character to an extent, but I don't see him as being terribly original. Well, written yes.
He reminds me of a child. It's as if they are all Id and have no Super Ego at all. It's his wants. His needs. His way. That only he knows what is right for the world any everyone in it. It's pretty well the definition of a God Complex.
Post by sickVisionz (4,221 posts) See mini bio Level 24
Moderator
@FoxxFireArt: But she WANTS to be manipulated.  When she's first introduced she comes to his house and tells him to use her as he wants, even if that means killing her.  He's not conning her.  He hasn't tricked her.  She fell in love with him because he was a murderous psychopath who was manipulating those closest to him.  Everything he's done is 100% in character with the person she fell in love with.  She's crazy for wanting that out of a relationship, but it's what she wants. 
 
It's hard for me to feel sorry for someone who's getting exactly what she wants... especially when she's a stone cold killer with no remorse for her victims.
Post by LordCraven (46 posts) See mini bio Level 8

Acctually I have a little extra to add to your math, I think they say somewhere in the series (or How To Read) that when a shinigami dies their lifespan get added onto whoever they saved. So Whatever Gelus's lifespan was would've been added onto Misa's life.
Although I can't imagine him killing very many people when hes stalking Misa all the time, so it could'd be too much of a boost...
Post by FoxxFireArt (2,638 posts) See mini bio Level 25
Moderator
@sickVisionz:  
So, she's asking for it?? If a woman comes up to you and tells you she wants you to hit her, does that then make it all right to hit her?
She doesn't want to be manipulated. She's not getting what she really wants. She wants to be loved by him. 
Of coarse he's conning her. He's leading her to believe that if she does these things for him. Kill people, cut her life span in half...again. He will then return her love, and he has no intention of doing so. He's making her pay all the price and make all the sacrifices for him. That's a con.
 
She fell in love with Light, because he brought judgment down on the murderer of her parents when the justice system was failing her and was going to possibly let him free. It's not a good basis for devotion. It's textbook blind devotion and battered wife syndrome.
 
I don't deny she's a killer, but she's a lot more sympathetic then Light.
Post by Catolf (254 posts) See mini bio Level 13
@FoxxFireArt said:
 I can't see how someone could "root" for such a despicable psychopath who kills innocents, law enforcement, and is generally manipulative and abusive to women. This stuff is why I see Light lovers of having some serious issues with women. I know that sounds harsh, but this stuff is just sadistic.
Being a woman... I have no issues with women. Any time something has to do with something harming a woman or so on, everyone get's up in arms. Children too, even if it's fiticious. It's people, as a whole, if he's killing a man you should feel the same. Light has issues with humanity in general..
 
@FoxxFireArt said:
" @sickVisionz:   So, she's asking for it?? If a woman comes up to you and tells you she wants you to hit her, does that then make it all right to hit her?She doesn't want to be manipulated. She's not getting what she really wants. She wants to be loved by him.  Of coarse he's conning her. He's leading her to believe that if she does these things for him. Kill people, cut her life span in half...again. He will then return her love, and he has no intention of doing so. He's making her pay all the price and make all the sacrifices for him. That's a con. She fell in love with Light, because he brought judgment down on the murderer of her parents when the justice system was failing her and was going to possibly let him free. It's not a good basis for devotion. It's textbook blind devotion and battered wife syndrome.  I don't deny she's a killer, but she's a lot more sympathetic then Light. "

it's not a con. She knew what she was getting into, just as @sickVisionz:  said. She didn't care as long as she aided him in his quest, she wanted to be used by him, as long as she could stay at his side.
 

 
Yes, she deserved it, she know's better.. but she wishes to stay. She is a person whom is misguided and silly and if she chooses to stand with him, she takes the punishment that Light can dish. Which considering wasn't that bad, I've seen worse relationships.
 
they are kinda like Pinky and the Brain.
Post by sickVisionz (4,221 posts) See mini bio Level 24
Moderator
@FoxxFireArt:  
We'll have to agree to disagree.  I never thought of Misa as being some innocent girl who got caught up in something that she didn't want to get caught up in.  At no point was she unaware that Light was a manipulative bastard who killed hundreds of people, even innocent police officers.  Light didn't have some radical personality shift after they met.  When she first met Light she knew about Kira and Light even rejected her until she offered hers eyes, her death note and her life to Light in exchange for being his girlfriend. 
 
When start a relationship with someone like that who only agrees to associate with you under circumstances like that, I don't feel sorry for what that person does to you.  That's not him conning her imo.  That's both parties entering some blatant shame of a relationship.  Nothing Light did to her seemed out of place considering how their relationship started. 
 
I don't feel sympathy for anyone in the series who gets a Death Note and uses it to kill innocent people.  But I can at least understand where Light was initially coming from.  He started killing to make the world a better place and eventually started killing to save his own ass.  Misa's goals were never positive or some grand positive scheme.  She started killing so that some boy would ask her out on a date.  I can't feel sorry for a person like that.  Both of them got and get what they have coming to them. 
 
Plus, she's a blithering idiot.  Light is a smart murderous psycho.  That's at least 1 positive trait.  Misa's an moronic murderous psycho.  That's 0.
Post by Gasero (167 posts) See mini bio Level 9
@FoxxFireArt: 
Is it okay to agree with Light's ideas, but hate his methods? I dislike the actions that Light does throughout the series, but I like that he wanted to rid the world of criminals. The problem is that he took it way too far and got off track trying to kill the police force.
 
The whole battered wife syndrome with Misa is also a mixed bag for me. I find it hard to empathize with someone that is willingly abused in hopes that one day the abuser will change their ways. At any time Misa could have reported or avoided Light and his deceptiveness, but she chose to let herself be used. I'm no psychologist, but I wouldn't care if he avenged my parents, Light is crazy.
Post by FoxxFireArt (2,638 posts) See mini bio Level 25
Moderator
@Catolf: 
So, because Light isn't beating these women to death with his own hands, but he's robbing them of their life span or writing their names down in a death note. That qualifies as an acceptable method of killing someone that is worth supporting? 

I point out this issue as one of many. People talk about the scene where Light gets the name of Naomi Misora earlier in the series. People point to that scene of him getting her name as a point that made them feel "happy". Even though he doesn't just write her name down. He tells her that he's Kira to one, put her down and make her feel foolish for trusting the person who murdered her lover; and to terrorize her so she will know he's going to kill her next. He could of just written her name down later, but he wanted to torment her first.
She was a complete innocent out to find justice for her murdered lover. The most sympathetic kind of person possible. Yet, for much of the audience. Watching him use, terrorize, and murder her makes them "happy" and "root" for him? Still, I seem to be the only one who finds that disconcerting?
 
A con man manipulates the affections of another person to get what they want out of a another person. They will mislead, lie, and cheat for their own goal, but have no intention of giving their target what they really desire. That is a con job, and that is what Light is doing to Misa.
He is asking her to give up more of her life to serve him and letting her believe that if she does this he will return her love. He has no intention of ever loving her and is only using her for his own ends. Rather then stealing her money. He's stealing her life.
A talented con man makes you want to give them things.
 
@Gasero said:
" @FoxxFireArt:  The whole battered wife syndrome with Misa is also a mixed bag for me. I find it hard to empathize with someone that is willingly abused in hopes that one day the abuser will change their ways. At any time Misa could have reported or avoided Light and his deceptiveness, but she chose to let herself be used.  "
I think you are misunderstanding the concept of the battered wife syndrome. It's a deep psychological issue that deals with severe inferiority complex. More often these woman will be beaten half to death, but be the first one's to defend their attacker. Often times refusing to testify in court against their attacker (husband, boyfriend, etc.).
These women choose to stay in these relationships that will get someone killed., because they don't believe they are worthy of better.
 
How is that not worth some level of sympathy? When I see a woman who has had her lip split open, skull fractured, and eyes blackened by someone who she is defending. I don't think she deserves that abuse because she could leave. I feel sorry, because that's the best she thinks she deserves.
Light may not be hitting Misa, but he is stealing har life away for his own goal.
Post by Catolf (254 posts) See mini bio Level 13
@FoxxFireArt said:
" @Catolf:  So, because Light isn't beating these women to death with his own hands, but he's robbing them of their life span or writing their names down in a death note. That qualifies as an acceptable method of killing someone that is worth supporting?  I point out this issue as one of many. People talk about the scene where Light gets the name of Naomi Misora earlier in the series. People point to that scene of him getting her name as a point that made them feel "happy". Even though he doesn't just write her name down. He tells her that he's Kira to one, put her down and make her feel foolish for trusting the person who murdered her lover; and to terrorize her so she will know he's going to kill her next. He could of just written her name down later, but he wanted to torment her first.She was a complete innocent out to find justice for her murdered lover. The most sympathetic kind of person possible. Yet, for much of the audience. Watching him use, terrorize, and murder her makes them "happy" and "root" for him? Still, I seem to be the only one who finds that disconcerting?
She was an obstacle, and I think you take the fact that it was a woman more to heart than the actual task at hand. I don't think we'd have this argument if Naomi was a male. No one would care. In real life no one would root for the behavior, this is certain, but the audiance seense what the ideal as a whole is..
 
and you have to break a few egg's to make an omelet, it's a sad truth, if Naomi had gotten together with L, she would have STILL been killed, she was an obstacle who would have tried to stop him from his goal. No one is safe.. no one said they were happy that he did what he did. I've never read a post like that on here.
 
Relief was used. Strange relief of seeing Light get his way and seeing things continue knowing the ride was going to end.
 
@FoxxFireArt said:
A con man manipulates the affections of another person to get what they want out of a another person. They will mislead, lie, and cheat for their own goal, but have no intention of giving their target what they really desire. That is a con job, and that is what Light is doing to Misa. He is asking her to give up more of her life to serve him and letting her believe that if she does this he will return her love. He has no intention of ever loving her and is only using her for his own ends. Rather then stealing her money. He's stealing her life.A talented con man makes you want to give them things. "
In a sense she got exactly what she wanted. He came home to her, he 'adored' her the attention he gave, both negative and slightly positive made her satisfied..
 
He didn't con her, she KNEW what she was getting into the MOMENT she came to him. Rem did too, thus the threat to keep her safe. Misa knew he life was in danger, you can't say he conned her when she knew what was going to happen, thus = no con.
Post by AgentJ (1,545 posts) See mini bio Level 13
@FoxxFireArt: I'm not going to get into this whole conversation, but I took his snark after finding her name as "gloating after a victory". We all know that Light is obsessed with winning more than anything else, and all bigtime competitors gloat. He had just pulled victory from the snatches of defeat, and for a guy like him who is swiftly losing his grip on the idea of "death" and "murder", it was nothing more than a "YEAH, that JUST happened" moment. Or at least, thats the way I saw it. 
Post by ZachTheAnimeGeek (76 posts) See mini bio Level 6

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