Crunchyroll Still Has Fansubs; ANN is Now a Cop

Topic started by gia on Jan. 23, 2009. Last post by omo 6 years, 2 months ago.
Post by gia (3,032 posts) See mini bio Level 13
You're Under Arrest! (Get it?)
You're Under Arrest! (Get it?)
Should we call it...Crunchygate? Crack investigators at ANN have spotted a number of fansub videos still available at Crunchyroll, including titles that are already being distributed officially on the site. And it turns out that a lot of the previously-deleted fansub videos are still acessible if you have the direct URL to them-- they just won't show up in a search.

That said, there were a lot of videos on the site, and as founder Vu Nguyen pointed out to ANN: “this process takes a little while due to the size of the site.”

So, is Crunchyroll being all slowpoke.jpg, or are fans just being impatient?

Post by OkazukiIchigo (350 posts) See mini bio Level 11
haha! Crunchygate....

Too much puns.. sorry
Post by omo (113 posts) See mini bio Level 2
Gia, could you try to get a hold of Pony Canyon and see what they have to say about this...?

This is kind of a developing situation. The AoDVD guys are diligent in tracking what got screened by CR, we presume, by tracking certain formalities CR goes through for each show they have license for. For example, adding an official group mod for that show's group, etc. So we think CR knows that there are still fansubs in place for some of those titles. It's unclear if this was a mistake, someone neglected something, or something done on purpose. If it was done on purpose, was it kind of a casual sleight of hand? Like, a hold-over until CR can get around putting up the legit videos for those shows? We don't know.

The complication here isn't so much what CR is using is illegal in the usual sense; after all they probably do have permission from the original licensor, even if not for the fansubs. But the fansubbers could issue a C&D, lol.

No harm no foul?
Post by gia (3,032 posts) See mini bio Level 13
omo, I'll see what I can do-- my track record for getting comments from Japanese companies hasn't been great; the industry (and Japanese business in general) are much more formal about press dealings @.o Plus it's the weekend in Japan!

That said..I'm not sure if fansubbers would have legal grounds for a C&D or a lawsuit. After all, the Japanese companies have the copyrights to the script, period. If I were to take a Japanese script to an anime episode and translate it, I wouldn't really have any rights over that translation...since it's rote and uncreative, it doesn't even count as a derivative work.
Post by omo (113 posts) See mini bio Level 2
Hi Gia, thanks for trying at any rate. I mean, I don't expect that PC will cooperate in a meaningful way anyways, but that might alert them to this little thing that CR is doing.

Hey, a legal question! Something I know a thing or two.

A translation by nature and by US law is a derivative work (USC 17 101). However a derivative work is still created by the person who created the derivative work, and not the creator of the original work. All this just means that if Pony Canyon wants to sue whoever created the fansubs, they can obtain the rights to the translation if they sued for it. But until a court enters that into judgment, technically and practically the derivative work is still owned by whoever created it. Creators of derivative works still have rights under US copyright laws too even if they did it without permission, so it's not a wash even for fansubbers even if they totally lose out. (Most importantly, the fansubbers are still the authors of the translations, and people who use the translation have to accredit them accordingly.)
Post by gia (3,032 posts) See mini bio Level 13
Interesting, and I stand thoroughly corrected-- good to know.

That said, I have a hard time imagining fans getting together the funds for any legal action...and even if they did, I don't imagine many anime fans-- American or Japanese --would support fans suing the original creators.

...It's actually pretty hard to imagine the whole scenario, honestly.
Post by omo (113 posts) See mini bio Level 2
On a curious side note, Dattebayo issued a lot of DMCA takedown notices for Naruto on youtube over the past few years (they mentioned this publically in a few places). I guess that would be the thing a concerned fansubber would do in this situation if his or her work is on CR right now.

ORRRR, be a good sport and send CR an invoice ;)
Post by gia (3,032 posts) See mini bio Level 13
You know, if I were a fansubber, personally? I'd say-- my goal with fansubbing was to get this series out for people to see. I did this work not expecting any pay, and if a company is using my translations for an official release, it's in the name of getting the series out to more people, so it's fine by me.

That said, I can also understand feeling pretty put out over not getting credit for my hard work, even if I never wanted to get paid for it.
Post by Shii (6 posts) See mini bio Level 9
Why does it matter if CR still has fansubs up? It's a civil issue, not criminal. The producers aren't complaining, so...?
Post by omo (113 posts) See mini bio Level 2
Well, the producers (if you follow the ANN article to AoDVD forums) are complaining. It's just that the producers are fansubbers.
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